Designing Effective Vehicles for Second Life

Elegant vehicle design in Second Life is easy to pick up, hard to master.   I was noodling around Balance— the old-school vehicle testing sim– in a 2009 Tread, and realized that a few useful design decisions surface again and again in each of my successful vehicles.

The Tread is a 'simple' single mode land vehicle in Second Life
The Tread is a 'simple' single mode land vehicle in Second Life. Simple to the user because it has been scripted with much user-centric complexity.

Time to reflect on vehicle design principles a bit using some experiences, actual SL vehicle use statistics, and broader design ideas from the web and beyond.

Simple Dashboard, Powerful Engine

Perhaps my most fun (my metric for successful) vehicle in Second Life is the Elemental.  It transforms into about a dozen distinct vehicles: planes, airships, hovercraft, cars, submarines, etc.  Very early on in the design process for the Elemental, it became clear that a dozen (now even more than that! Crazy.) modes would need quite a user interface to keep things fluid and easy,  so that these extra features were fun and not a hindrance.  Immediately, the decision was to use a Heads Up Display (“HUD”).

The HUD for the Elemental is 100% buttons.
The HUD for the Elemental is 100% buttons.

The reasoning was simple.   Before SL added HUD attachments, users had to endure experience-disrupting blue dialog windows for the rare vehicle, like the Dominus Shadow, that was smart enough to use them.  Much more often, a user had to:

  1. learn chat command syntax (e.g., “start” and “hover” to activate various vehicle functionality)
  2. remember the syntax across sessions
  3. take the time to correctly type out the command, time away from having fun
  4. understand what the command would do

It is an experience design disaster.

So instead, Elemental users got a smart little HUD, where only the absolute minimum visual information necessary was displayed at any given time.  This is a design principle that Google, Inc. has in its very genetics, closely regulating the number of words on its homepage.  From a user experience standpoint, every moment my mouse is buried in the HUD is a moment I’ve lost forever.  So the HUD uses collapsing menus:

The Elemental HUD reveals additional UI elements and choices only as necessary
The Elemental HUD reveals additional UI elements and choices only as necessary.

This way, new users have a gentler learning curve.  Why?  Because SL has been hard to learn since Day One.  No need to make it any more frustrating.  This was especially important when I was designing vehicles through Electric Sheep Company for Nissan, Reuters, and other companies interested in having an engaging presence in SL.  They were bringing totally new users inworld, so things had to be dead simple to learn, but fun.

Of course simple, intuitive UI does not mean boring.  The Elemental is still one of the only vehicles to pack a dozen modes, cloaking, three combat systems, 5 point sound, skinning/coloring/custom license plates, decals, Tiny mode, autopilot, onboard music, and more.  But the point is that the decisions to use or ignore all these elements aren’t all clamoring for the user’s attention.  They are neatly tucked away, ready for when the user is ready to explore more fun.

A similar principle applies beyond HUDs, right into the physical shape of the vehicle itself.  When I was in the process of designing the precursor to the Elemental, the Tread, a series of informal qualitative interviews helped me to understand that the prims I was gluing together were more than a chassis, they were the user’s avatar with respect to the physics engine.

Note the invisible ramp prim affixed to the front end of this ground vehicle, used to skate over small obstacles.
Note the invisible ramp prim affixed to the front end of this ground vehicle, used to skate over small obstacles.

The ramp on the Tread above is invisible to the user, completely unannounced unless the user decides to edit the vehicle and discovers it for him/herself.   Given the extremely haphazard environment in SL, users get stuck in vehicles all the time.  So behind the scenes — under the hood, if you will– we vehicle designers have an obligation to protect the user from the sligns and arrows of cruel grid life, without limiting the user in his or her options.  Simple hacks like adding invisible ramps and the ability for cars to either jump or fly adds orders of magnitude more spaces that your users can access. And that means more fun for them and better-satisfied customers for you, the designer.

To drive home the point (pardon the pun): the following graph is a time series (x axis)  of vehicle velocity (y axis, m/s) for a typical Elemental user.   Note the average speed, but even more importantly, note how jagged the graph is.  This is a user battling rough terrain and the normal clutter of SL, trying to have fun.

Note the inconsistent movement rate of a typical land vehicle session.
Note the inconsistent movement rate of a typical land vehicle session.

By contrast, a similar graph for a helicopter user:

Note fewer speed inconsistencies, suggesting a better-controlled vehicle experience.
Note fewer speed inconsistencies, suggesting a better-controlled vehicle experience.

If you can hack an existing vehicle script to perform how you like, you can add a hover mode or jump functionality.  No excuses, do it. We all win when the general calibre of vehicle designs in SL gets elevated.

Who cares if cars can’t fly or jump in real life?  The immersion vs. augmentation shtick has been done to death for years now. At the end of the day, users still get stuck in vehicles too easily, when the vehicle desingers can easily solve that problem a priori.

Bottom line for this aspect of SL vehicle design: think so your users never really have to.  Not that they can’t.  Just that they shouldn’t have to if they don’t want to.

Avatar Height vs. Vehicle Users in Second Life: Statistics

My head explodes when I contemplate statistics. However, it is important for Second Life vehicle designers like me to understand our audiences. Read on for a brief treatment of avatar height as it relates to vehicle users, and what that might mean for vehicle designers. I’ll present the data, then discuss how I got it.

Avatar height has a lot to do with vehicles. Specifically, how big do you make the vehicle such that it fits the pilot/driver and any desired passengers comfortably? Will you need to fold them up with an animation so that the avatar collision box won’t interfere with vehicle functionality?

As in RL, the fashion among top tier vehicles tends to run toward “snug-fitting.” Av heights can naturally range from 1.1 to 2.4m, but users aren’t evenly distributed among this range.

The following table presents the quantiles for height among vehicle users in SL, expressed in units of SL’s native metric system.


Height (m)

100% Max








75% Q3


50% Median


25% Q1








0% Min


n = 739,777

mean = 1.91 m

For those of you reflexively going zomgwtf, the tight range between quantiles 1 and 3 suggest that a big chunk of SL users are tightly clustered with respect to height. In this case, they happen to be clustered near the median height, 2.0 m.

For those of you still going zomgwtf, here’s a nice picture (click for full size):

Use-weighted vehicle user height distribution

Notice a few things:

1) You can see from the graph that most all users are within +/- 0.2 meters of 2.0 m tall.

2) See the uptick on the left hand of the graph? Those are tinies (1.1 m) and ageplayers (1.2 m). Haha! I’m kidding. Sort of.

3) From a biometry standpoint (and a sociology of virtual worlds standpoint), these results are endlessly fascinating. Recall from your biology class that many physical characteristics, including human height, are normally distributed. That is, there are roughly an equal number of people taller and shorter than the average, and symmetrically so when you graph it out, as above.

That is clearly not the case “here” in Second Life. Vehicle users for whatever reason tend to favor being taller, but not extremely tall, and *extremely* short. The distribution pictured above isn’t by any means normal.

Specifically, we can use skewness and kurtosis to look at HOW non-normal SL heights are. For those of you trained in experiments, Kolmogorov-Smirnov D is 0.1839, p < 0.01. For those of you not trained in experiments, the SL distribution doesn’t model RL at all.

But that’s true in many ways. 😉

Now, these are use-weighted data, meaning that vehicle users who drive/pilot more often are accounted for more heavily. Non-use weighted data are similar enough in this case that it isn’t worth my time to report.

Twinity Beta versus Second Life

So I get an email today that the Twinity beta test now has room for me. Joy.

Dear Logan,

There is now a space open for you in the Twinity beta!
You have the opportunity to be one of the very first
people to see Twinity, the new virtual world that mashes
up real and virtual life.

Signing up for Twinity is free.

And so forth and so on with a link to the client download. So I run through the setup screens and I get dumped into a world map. Very pretty.

Twinity World Map

It is all glowy-when-you-mouseover a country. So I select a country, but nothing much really happens. I select one a buncha times, still zip. Not to be stymied, I look around, see a list of cities at the bottom of the screen, and find a “create place” button. That sounds promising. Off we go. Along the way, I see that I am either registered user number 310, or number 310 currently online. Who knows?

I go through the create place dialog. For some reason Twinity constrains me to create my location in one of four or so cities in my selected country, the USA. So I pick New York out of the list, and name my little place after my actual city.

Then Twinity gives me the chance to select the layout of my place from a short list of templates, like club, atelier place, etc. Finishing these options, I create my place and voila, there I am.

Right away I see that this Twinity has something over Second Life. It drags you along on rails and makes you learn how to… do whatever it is you’re supposed to do in Twinity. My little avatar, we’ll call him Joe Chubbycheeks, shows up in a nicely texture-baked flat or apartment.

Joe Chubbycheeks

Joe’s not going to win any fashion contests with his well-rounded (read: fat) head, but let’s be honest. Second Life’s Ruth avatar is at least equally fugly. Ok, at least Ruth doesn’t have little stripes tattooed across her face. Maybe some day.

Joe’s an enterprising guy, so I decide to have him decorate the place. I know I can decorate because the helpful little tooltips told me so. Right clicking on anything brings up an integrated shop/my inventory/upload asset interface, all apparently linked to the thing I right-clicked on.Object mod interface

Apparently I don’t have anything in my inventory with which to furnish the place and everything in the shop costs linden dollars spacebucks or whatever the local denomination is [“globals” –ed.], so for a moment I’m sad. Then I realize the kind beta developers have given me a thousand spacebucks to start with! Welcome to my financial empire!

On my way to shop for a loveseat, I get distracted by the clothes section of the shop. Mr. Chubbycheeks dons his shiny new baseball cap for $20 spacebucks globals a moment later.

I try to camscan out the window– I see ripple water out there– but the camera is constrained to stay inside my brown-wallpapered walls. Shame. If I can’t figure out how to open the windows, then I can’t throw myself out them. Safe for the moment.

Already I can see that even in beta, parts of the UI have so much more finesse than the Second Life client does. Menu panels fade in and out, and clothing items at least are previewed in 3d before you buy them within the shop interface.

I have started with three outfits, default, basics and business, stored in a nice tabbed interface. Slightly disconcerting that one cannot yet strip to the buff, but then again, I’m still standing next to the window.

As I wander a bit more, it becomes clear the the lighting model is still under development. There’s a sense that Joe’s face is underlit, while the back of the poor guy is well-lit.
Lighting model

To console myself of Joe’s skin problem, I decide to buy a sink from that handy store interface. A couple of right-clicks and clicks and yes-its-ok-to-spend-my-spacebucks globals, and my sink is now hovering in space in my room. It is tipped forward 90 degrees, but never fear! We can rotate the sucker. But not on the right axis…? A few minutes tinkering doesn’t quite get me to where the sink wants to be, so I scrub it and try to go exploring.

As I’m driving myself nuts over how to pen my front door, I realize that Twinity has one killer interface feature over SL so far: the shop is integrated right into the inventory. No minimizing the client to find slexchange or onRez. No teleporting to some laggy shop filled with flexi prim trees and bling. Just a few clicks. Not terribly immersive to the sense of being in the world of twinity, but extremely convenient. Perhaps the Second Life inventory Library section is an apt parallel.

After banging my head on the door for awhile, it seems clear that I can’t quite go outside very easily yet. It’s ok, Twinity is still in early beta. So instead, I drop back to that world map and teleport somewhere, Chez Mareike. After a minute or so, the place rezzes in fully. For awhile, it is a little strange; the walls and floor rez last of all, leaving me standing in midair, surrounded by bar kitsch until the floor materializes.

Browsing through the location info, to my surprise I see a weather report giving temperature, moon phase, and cloudiness? The temperature looks about right for this time of year, just above freezing.

Here, someone has installed lights. The local lighting looks better than in SL, and maps nicely onto the objects around the place as well.

Poking around the chat interface, it looks like no one else is around. Well, at least there are cheery little butterflies flitting around.

Taking a step back from Chez Mareike, I reflect on how at this stage, Twinity is so far a stripped down and simplified version of Second Life. It takes the “pimp out a default house and meet people” approach as far as I can tell. Put up your posters, rewallpaper, install a web browser framed on your wall, rub elbows with people.

As a Second Life user, this place is a little frustrating so far, but it is early yet, and I must not lose sight of the fact that so many people don’t WANT an SL. They want a mySpace version, just like most people aren’t interested in learning HTML to put up a proper website. Afterall, the simple version is all a lot of people are seeking.

Vehicle Use in Second Life: Spatial Distribution

As part of an ongoing effort to understand vehicles and their users in Second Life, I created a series of maps that depict where users of the vehicle that I’ve designed, the Elemental, go while they’re using it.

Currently there are about 100,000 Elementals in circulation on the Second Life grid.  About a third of those, or 30,000+, have been active in the last month or so.  There may be a better way to understand how many Elementals/users are out there and active, but I will let LL, Massively,  and Terra Nova wrestle that out.  It isn’t my focus.

When you make a gridwide plot of where the vehicles have been (about a quarter million records), you get a map something like the following, composed in ESRI’s ArcMap:

Point Plot of Vehicle Use Locations in Second Life

Using the Elemental use as a proxy for vehicle use more broadly, we see interesting tidbits emerge.  The outlines of the “mainland” continents are clearly  in the lower right quadrant of the map.  Vehicle use on private estates, by contrast, is much much lower.  This spatial relationship becomes much more apparent when we use a smoothing algorithm to interpolate densities of use between known points:

Density Map of Vehicle Use in Second Life

Density Map of Vehicle Use in Second Life

View this like a thermal image: lighter equals more dense vehicle use.  Black means little or none.  This kind of spatial interpolation is something of a ruse, though in the SL grid; vehicle use must be zero in True Void, that is, those gaps in the grid where no simulator is happily simulating away.  In practice, so much of the grid is the True Void.  In RL, the surface of the Earth has no such gaps.  Still it provides a useful visualization of vehicle use on the grid.

Interestingly, it is apparent that only a few dozen private estates feature vehicle use as  densely as the mainland.  I would speculate that this is due to region contiguity, that is, it is more fun to operate a vehicle on the grid when you have lots of connected sims nearby– you cover a 256m square pretty fast in a vehicle.  However, I must underscore that my speculation is just that.  Unfortunately, I don’t have an automatic way to evaluate region contiguity yet, or other possible contributing factors.

Zooming in a bit on the mainland areas and cranking down the search radius for the density algorithm, a clear hotspot for vehicle use emerges.  Perhaps unsurprisingly, the sandbox and vehicle regions in the extreme southwest of the old original landmass are the most densely used areas for vehicle use:

Old Mainland Vehicle Use

It seems clear that several ingredients are necessary for heavy vehicle use, which also appear to be unifying factors among the sims most heavily used above: clear, open, gently terraformed terrain, powerful servers (except in the case of water void sims, where few collisions occur) , and contiguity.

Note the clear visibility of the marine strait connecting the old main continent to the Lepidoptera continent to the north (lepidoptera are butterflies and moths, etc.).  Also, note the small cluster of sims to the far east.  I believe those are water voids as well.

Unfortunately, this reveals a powerful quandary in vehicle design: proper enjoyment of this aspect of Second Life requires large open spaces with unmediated access which are very expensive!  Given the tight competition of the vehicle market, I would be surprised to see any vehicle makers easily able to provide this kind of resource for customers.   Pontiac, a huge RL carmaker, is closing up shop in Second Life, shutting down one of the most active and well-managed vehicle centers on the grid. Lacking these resources, vehicle enthusiasts are more or less forced to rely on the largesse of void sim owners for space to recreate.  Food for thought.

Dec. 18th 2007 Havok4 Office Hours Transcript

[11:06]  Andrew Linden: Last week I offered a limited time bounty for finding new ways to crash Havok4 regions.
[11:06]  Andrew Linden: The challenge expired Sunday at midnight
[11:07]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Oh, any takers? I think Redux managed to crash it
[11:07]  Andrew Linden: I awarded two bounties
[11:07]  Andrew Linden: I received a third submission, but the region and time were not included in the info
[11:08]  Andrew Linden: and it looked like a duplicate of the second award at a casual glance
[11:08]  Andrew Linden: I think Dan Linden sent me some chat transcripts and other info on some other crashes
[11:08]  Andrew Linden: it wasn’t clear to me if those were submissions for the bounty or not
[11:08]  Squirrel Wood: I tried to find out how many script instructions per second the havok 4 sims would handle… we hold at about 4 million ips ^^
[11:09]  Gaius Goodliffe: Can you tell if any old random crash on the beta grid is related to Havok4 or not?
[11:09]  Andrew Linden: Squirrel, do you have a comparison of ips on Havok1? I’d imagine the host machine would influence such a benchmark.
[11:09]  Squirrel Wood: the crash me sims on the main grid are on h4
[11:10]  Squirrel Wood: a class 5 sim tends to max out at 4 million ips
[11:10]  Andrew Linden: Gaius, I was checking the coredumps to find out if it was a Havok4 problem specifically.
[11:10]  Andrew Linden: Both of the crash modes that received bounties were from running out of memory
[11:10]  Andrew Linden: however they went about it two different ways
[11:10]  Gaius Goodliffe nods.
[11:11]  Andrew Linden: Neither crash mode was something that I have time to fix in Havok4
[11:11]  Andrew Linden: however I submitted reports to Don Linden
[11:11]  Andrew Linden: who is in charge of the #blacklight studio, and is usually working on important bugs and critical issues.
[11:12]  Andrew Linden: There hasn’t been a lot of noteworthy bugs fixed, or development in Havok4 in the last week or two.
[11:13]  Andrew Linden: Simon has been tweaking the Runtime Collision Control System and has checked in a few improvements.
[11:13]  Andrew Linden: Over the last week or so I’ve been working on some mass-properties utilities
[11:13]  Wind Key 2 ~ GAMBIT: BAM~!
[11:13]  target-aim 0.3: Hello, Avatar!
[11:13]  Andrew Linden: the idea being… we should compute our own mass and inertia instead of asking Havok for that info
[11:13]  Seifert Surface: why?
[11:13]  Andrew Linden: such utilities will fix about three different bugs, and I’m almost finished
[11:14]  Andrew Linden: just writing unit tests now and trying to find one last known bug in the utilities.
[11:14]  Andrew Linden: Seifert, Havok’s mass properties utilities have some problems.
[11:15]  Andrew Linden: (1) the object must have a RigidBody in the phyics engine before we can query it for mass properties
[11:15]  Andrew Linden: and attachments don’t have RigidBody’s any more, and yet the script-energy depends on the object’s mass
[11:15]  Seifert Surface: ah
[11:16]  Andrew Linden: (2) the values we’re getting from havok are just wrong… they use a surface mass distribution method, instead of a solid geometry system.
[11:16]  Andrew Linden: (3) … There is a third problem but I can’t remember what it is atm
[11:16]  Gaius Goodliffe: Will it ever be possible to programatically set the mass of an object, so say a bag of sand has more mass than a bag of helium?
[11:16]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Though I’d like to mention, attachments in Havok1 never seem to run out of energy
[11:17]  Andrew Linden: oh right… (3) the mass properpties computations are somewhat expensive, and I’d like to cache some of them
[11:18]  Andrew Linden: Gaius, it won’t be possible to manually override the mass properties of objects until we have our own mass properties utilities
[11:18]  Andrew Linden: so… our own utilities will enable:
[11:18]  Andrew Linden: (4) manual overrides
[11:18]  Gaius Goodliffe nods.
[11:18]  Andrew Linden: (5) per-prim density settings
[11:18]  Seifert Surface: cool
[11:18]  Andrew Linden: However, (4) and (5) would come sometime after Havok4 is actually done
[11:18]  Gaius Goodliffe: Of course. First things first. 🙂
[11:19]  Andrew Linden: So that is all of the “state of Havok” updates I’ve got.
[11:19]  Andrew Linden: Sidewinder probably has some announcements..
[11:19]  SL Exchange Magic Box w/ANS: SL Exchange – Delivered item Elemental HUD.
[11:19]  Sidewinder Linden: thanks… yes… we are going to reload the beta preview this afternoon, with a different region configuration
[11:20]  Sidewinder Linden: this is based ont he chanes that we talked about at the last office hours
[11:20]  Sidewinder Linden: i’ll hand out a notecard iwth the proposed new “core configuration”
[11:20]  Andrew Linden: specifically, you’re talking about reducing the number of regions to some minimum
[11:20]  Andrew Linden: to allow for more private estate trials on the preview
[11:21]  Sidewinder Linden: yes… this list is what i came up with for a “core configuration” – reginos that should be there on an ongoing basis for various specific reasons
[11:21]  Sidewinder Linden: this leaves a lot of slots for rotating other regions from the main system into the preview so taht we can test completely assembled and operational regions easily
[11:21]  Seifert Surface: seems like a sensible thing to do
[11:21]  Sidewinder Linden: we also have put up a rack of class 5 servers – i think there are now going to be six class 5 hosts on the preview, which is 24 regions of class 5
[11:22]  Kitto Flora: Wish didn’t make it huh?
[11:22]  Sidewinder Linden: should it be on the core, or the rotating set?
[11:22]  Sidewinder Linden: i can add it if it should be…
[11:22]  Andrew Linden: (hrm… I’m pretty sure the last bug in my mass properties stuff is floating point error, exacerbated by adding and subtracting large nearly equal numbers)
[11:22]  Sidewinder Linden: btw one thing to know is that now putting new regions on to the preview will be very easy and can be scheduled
[11:22]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Can we do half core half rotating?
[11:22]  Sidewinder Linden: that is actually *about* what this is
[11:23]  Sidewinder Linden: i havnen’t got a final count, but i believe that this is about half of the total region slots
[11:23]  Squirrel Wood: furnation… those sims tend to get griefed a lot
[11:23]  Sidewinder Linden: the plan is to set up so that regions on the beta preview will run on the same hardware that they use on the public system, so to some degree this will depends on the mappings of region to class of host
[11:23]  Seifert Surface: will they get griefed in beta?
[11:23]  Sidewinder Linden: yes… there is one furnation sim in the core list… do there need to be more?
[11:24]  Sidewinder Linden: probably
[11:24]  Squirrel Wood: if its one of the sandbox sims that should do the trick
[11:24]  Sidewinder Linden: well i shouldn’t say probably… wouldn’t be surprising, however it would be handled in the same way as main system
[11:24]  Sidewinder Linden: and with h4 hopefully it won’t be as successful
[11:24]  Andrew Linden: The estate owners can set their regions private if they want… it’s just the Beta
[11:24]  Sidewinder Linden: right
[11:24]  Sidewinder Linden: oh good point andrew – when we copy a region to the beta, it will automatically pull all of its security settings
[11:25]  Sidewinder Linden: so private regions will be private on beta
[11:25]  Sidewinder Linden: unless the owner decides to openthem up
[11:25]  Sidewinder Linden: does this look like a reasonable core list, with the idea that we can swap in other regions for a few days for specific testing easily?
[11:25]  Couples MultiAnimator v2e whispers: * Abranimations Couples Animator Ready…
[11:25]  Kitto Flora: Seems like a vast quantity to me
[11:26]  Squirrel Wood: looks good to me
[11:26]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Looks good tome
[11:26]  Sorraya Pera: sissipoo
[11:27]  Sidewinder Linden: kitto – too many in the core?
[11:27]  Sidewinder Linden: easy to trim it 🙂
[11:27]  Velve Hax: ~~*~SiSsssSSssy!!~*~~
[11:27]  Kitto Flora: Well any testing I could do there Ive already done. And it only needed 2 H4 sims and 1 H1 sim
[11:27]  Sidewinder Linden: we were also thinking that with a lot of people on the beta preview folks will want enough space to spread out at times
[11:28]  Sidewinder Linden: oh btw – the havok1 sims are not in this list, but would be maintained after the reconfig
[11:28]  Kitto Flora: If one cannot set up large scale stuff on the sim, its pretty much useless for me now
[11:28]  Sidewinder Linden: what does that mean kitto?
[11:28]  Sidewinder Linden: in other words what would you need?
[11:28]  Kitto Flora: Ability to keep stuff around for more than 30 mins
[11:28]  Kitto Flora: or 60 mins.. whatever it is
[11:29]  Sidewinder Linden: hmmm
[11:29]  Sidewinder Linden: well if wish were on the preview you wouldn’t have that problem, right?
[11:29]  Kitto Flora: Right
[11:29]  Seifert Surface: large amounts of the space generally up on beta seems to be no build (or at least has been in the past)
[11:29]  Sidewinder Linden: actually i think i have it in the “resident regions list” to be deployed – just not in core
[11:29]  Kitto Flora: Exactly Seifert
[11:29]  Kitto Flora: All one can do in suchj places is play with whats there
[11:30]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Well, we need no build areas too, as well as no object entry, no script, etc.
[11:30]  Seifert Surface: yes
[11:30]  Gaius Goodliffe nods.
[11:30]  Andrew Linden: We usually pull the regions over as-is, so if they are no-build originally that is how they show up in the preview
[11:30]  Seifert Surface: but not entire sims of it
[11:30]  Ryozu Yamamoto: As it stands, there is a bug that affects no build areas
[11:30]  Kitto Flora: And usually thats not physics critical stuff
[11:30]  Sidewinder Linden: ok… so how about this… we start with this list, and then we can tune this to get cloer to “right”
[11:30]  Sidewinder Linden: right… andrew’s point is the reason for figuring out “the right core list”
[11:30]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Remember, “Physics” doesn’t just affect prims with the physics checkbox checked
[11:30]  Sidewinder Linden: the easy and maintainable solution is to pull over the regions that are already configured in the way that is useful
[11:31]  Redux Decosta: right; theres an h1 crash that involves sitting inside or walking over natural toruses; its still a massive physics crash even though they’re nonphysical
[11:31]  Kitto Flora: Well the GSLR sims are one such – and you got them
[11:31]  Sidewinder Linden: ok
[11:32]  Gaius Goodliffe: If we have Blue, Mauve, and Lime, might I suggest Mocha? When you’re flying around testing, being able to circle a “four corners” spot can be helpful.
[11:32]  Sidewinder Linden: ok
[11:32]  Squirrel Wood: h1… all you need is rez two physical tori that are stuck within each other… should cause an instant crash
[11:32]  Redux Decosta: has there been any playing with havok4 on void sims yet?
[11:32]  Sidewinder Linden: only marginally – that’s why i added the sailing courses those are void sims
[11:33]  Sidewinder Linden: and the sailing community is quite sensitive to dynamics (and have some pretty sophisticated sailboat scripting)
[11:33]  Sidewinder Linden: so this will let them find problems and retune their boats
[11:34]  Kitto Flora: Oh – I take that back. Looks like GSLR sims are not on the list either
[11:34]  Sidewinder Linden: k well maybe i misunderstood – which sims in particular are you talking about?
[11:34]  SL Exchange Magic Box w/ANS: SL Exchange – Delivered item Elemental HUD.
[11:34]  Kitto Flora: Well, guess I get Christmas off. Nothing to do.
[11:34]  Kitto Flora: The Sims that the GSLR run throug
[11:35]  Kitto Flora: Periwinkle…
[11:35]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Welcome Eata, grab a seat 😉
[11:35]  Sidewinder Linden: ahh oops – i had periwinkle and purple on the resident list
[11:35]  Sidewinder Linden: are those two the ones you meant?
[11:35]  Sidewinder Linden: hi eata
[11:35]  Kitto Flora: Yes
[11:35]  Kitto Flora: purple
[11:35]  Kitto Flora: maroon…
[11:35]  Sidewinder Linden: ok i’ll pu tthem in the core lst
[11:35]  Sidewinder Linden: do we need all three for testing?
[11:35]  Kitto Flora: two minimum
[11:35]  Eata Kitty: Well I just attempted to try the new windlight but it keeps silently dying before the loading screen gets up
[11:35]  Kitto Flora: Need to check boundary crossing
[11:36]  Sidewinder Linden: right … periwinkle and purple ok?
[11:36]  Ryozu Yamamoto: </3 New login =P
[11:36]  Kitto Flora: Yes, periwinkle and purple should be good
[11:36]  Sidewinder Linden: “done” 🙂
[11:37]  Eata Kitty: Havok 4?
[11:37]  Sidewinder Linden: ok so otherwise this looks like a decent starting point?
[11:37]  Sidewinder Linden: yes
[11:37]  Ryozu Yamamoto nods.
[11:37]  Sidewinder Linden: all of the core regions would be set up with havok4
[11:37]  Sidewinder Linden: and the existing havok1 regions would still be there
[11:37]  Gaius Goodliffe: Will they still have the useful warning ground texture saying Havok1?
[11:37]  Sidewinder Linden: yes
[11:37]  Gaius Goodliffe: Excellent. 🙂
[11:37]  Sidewinder Linden: oh – good point…. gaius… you may
[11:38]  Kitto Flora: Anyone know if Garth Fairchang is still active?
[11:38]  Sidewinder Linden: see over the next couple of weeks, some regions with other ground textures
[11:38]  Sidewinder Linden: another of the projects may put a few regions on the beta preview, so just make sure to check the ground texture before assuming it’s h4
[11:38]  Andrew Linden: Havok4 has been sitting on the preview too long. Other projects need some time there.
[11:38]  Sidewinder Linden: anything that is not h4 *should* have a ground texture explaining what it is
[11:39]  Squirrel Wood: Mono ?
[11:39]  Ryozu Yamamoto: May as well stick the H4 ground texture on H4 sims, heh
[11:39]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Just for the sake of clarity
[11:39]  Sidewinder Linden: could be 😉
[11:39]  Sidewinder Linden: ok… so last chance to hop up and down… any reason not to pull the trigger on this reconfiguration today?
[11:40]  Gaius Goodliffe: My apologies for missing the last couple meetings, I may be behind the curve a tad: last time I’d been here, we hadn’t moved on to vehicle bugs yet. Is that still the case, or are we looking at vehicle stuff now too?
[11:40]  Sidewinder Linden: ok… so then when i can get things lined up we’ll reload the region configuration. it probably makes sense to have the beta offline for an hour or so to make sure this went right, and i’llbring it back up asap after that
[11:41]  Sidewinder Linden: we are getting to the point of digging in farther on vehicles – likely with some more vigor after the holidays
[11:41]  Andrew Linden: We’re not quite back working on vehicles yet. But that is next.
[11:41]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Before we run out of time, I wanted to ask about the avatar velocity caps
[11:41]  Sidewinder Linden: go kitto
[11:41]  Kitto Flora: where?
[11:41]  Andrew Linden: Ah yes… avatar velocity caps…
[11:42]  Sidewinder Linden: @kitto (to your point!) 🙂
[11:42]  Andrew Linden: Ask the questions Ryozu.
[11:42]  Kitto Flora is lost
[11:42]  Sidewinder Linden: /oops – wrong name sorry kitto – thought ryozu’s question was yours…
[11:42]  Ryozu Yamamoto: I’ve played with them quite a bit, and honestly, I’m just not happy with them. In Current Havok1, velocity caps are nearly non-existent, and I have no qualms with putting caps into place
[11:42]  Kitto Flora: 🙂
[11:43]  Andrew Linden: Ryozu, you’ve tested the Havok4 caps recently? (In the last three weeks or so?)
[11:43]  Ryozu Yamamoto: Yes, specifically on the Crash me sims and on the beta grid

Random Ego Googling

a few random links about my recent work in Second Life.

It is still a bit strange to see me referred to as a master builder or scripter.  I am just out to have some fun, but it is nice to see that people enjoy my work a bit.

May 2007 Cory Linden Townhall Chat Log

[11:55]  moo Money: =O
[11:55]  Cerulean Capalini: lol
[11:55]  moo Money: never!
[11:55]  Lexa Pro: oh noes.
[11:55]  Nel Shan: Sorry, Josh. Missed it
[11:55]  Digital Digital: will the real linden plz stand up :P
[11:55]  moo Money: hihi
[11:55]  Mecha Dinosaur: Attack it’s weak point for MASSIVE damage!
[11:55]  Luth Brodie: lol
[11:55]  PetGirl Bergman: you did screwin a bulb josh? or what?
[11:55]  Joshua Nightshade: you’re fired nel.
[11:55]  Phoenix Psaltery: you’re right, moo, thats one they wouldnt break :)
[11:55]  Zagro Ferraris: Thers these to polymorphs walking down the street one turns into a bar and the other walks in and tells the bartender to make him a drink.
[11:55]  Lexa Pro steals everyones’ buckets.
[11:55]  You: Chadrick Linden walks into a bar
[11:55]  moo Money: ahahaha
[11:55]  Ravanne Sullivan: Lindens are mythical, like bigfoot
[11:55]  Kylix Petit: “Commander Taggart you are our only hope!”
[11:55]  You: and changes it to a tube, then a sphere.
[11:55]  Greho Otaared: Nooo! Ah wantz mah bukket!!
[11:55]  Jesse Linden: I am in fact. not real
[11:55]  Klink Epsilon: they are a bug inherant to the programming of the matrix
[11:55]  Mecha Dinosaur: Ugh I’m in the floor again..
[11:55]  Kitty Barnett: read
[11:55]  Gwynnie Boffin: YOU get a car! and YOU get a car!
[11:55]  Sascha Vandyke: hey, this region is very stable, does it run on older server software?
[11:55]  Notecard Writer: Still waiting for the “Applause” sign to rezz
[11:55]  Salazar Jack: Hurrah!
[11:55]  Lexa Pro: we’re goign to get NEW SCION TCS!
[11:55]  Wrestling Hulka: Torley! *gets out Watermelon Gun*
[11:55]  Zaphod Kotobide: Torley’s here. ALL RISE
[11:55]  No room to sit here, try another spot.
[11:55]  Nel Shan: Another LInden!
[11:55]  Kylix Petit: Jessee: I already told the joke about the siamese twins that moved to England so the other guy could drive.
[11:55]  Rob Adelaide: YAAAAY
[11:55]  Ravanne Sullivan: Oprah is hiding since her hair rezzed in her butt
[11:55]  Scarlett Qi: Hi Torley! Yoz! Cory!
[11:55]  Zjggy Stardust: ghosts! : O
[11:55]  Torley Linden: hi :)
[11:55]  SunShine Kukulcan: ZOMG..Cory
[11:55]  moo Money: omg a pig!
[11:55]  Gwynnie Boffin: yay Torley!!
[11:55]  moo Money: errr
[11:55]  moo Money: panda
[11:55]  Cerulean Capalini: lol
[11:55]  Rob Adelaide: Torley is a rockin Water-panda-melon
[11:55]  dale Cao: i wish we had voice
[11:55]  — End of Log —
[11:56]  Jeska Linden: Hello everyone!
[11:56]  Jesse Linden: just a moment folks
[11:56]  Notecard Writer high-fived Ravanne
[11:56]  Mecha Dinosaur: So that thsi would sound like a bunch of people talking over each other.. and thus we would be unable to hear each other?
[11:56]  Raul Crimson: hi, jeska
[11:56]  Jesse Linden: we’ll be starting soon
[11:56]  moo Money: it would be his first town hall as a resident
[11:56]  Brenda Maculate: I’m glad I was sitting for this… SEVEN Lindens in the same place….
[11:56]  Harleen Gretzky: Hi Jeska
[11:56]  Zagro Ferraris: YAY voice
[11:56]  Mo Miasma:    ^^^***  OMG  ***^^^
[11:56]  Marilyn Murphy: wanna run a pool on which linden crashes first?
[11:56]  Mo Miasma: lol
[11:56]  No room to sit here, try another spot.
[11:56]  Zagro Ferraris: almost didnt get the stream
[11:56]  Digital Digital: I can’t see any lindens :(
[11:56]  Cerulean Capalini: *clicks beers with the person next to her woo*
[11:56]  SunShine Kukulcan: what babe?
[11:56]  Wrestling Hulka: Lindens, can you guys post the prepared statements on the blog prior to when you copy/paste them?
[11:56]  Sascha Vandyke: the region will crash with so many lindens here
[11:56]  Doc Nielsen: We
[11:56]  moo Money: hey! be nice!
[11:56]  Heretic Linden: grr
[11:56]  Inigo Chamerberlin: That was cool – not
[11:56]  dale Cao: voice voice vvoice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice
[11:57]  moo Money: I didn’t complain even close to as much as you guys when I lost my entire inventory
[11:57]  Patchouli Woollahra shouts: Guys? we have over 50+ people in here, the client cuts out at 30. settle down and listen. please.
[11:57]  moo Money: show some respect
[11:57]  Zi Ree: so.. when we ..get Linux driver ..for voice chat? :P
[11:57]  dale Cao: voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice voice
[11:57]  Gwynnie Boffin: Dale, stop please
[11:57]  Nel Shan: Dale, shoosh
[11:57]  Mecha Dinosaur: Hahah voice chat.. now that’s a joke
[11:57]  Itoku Kamachi: My framerate went up when the Lindens arrived.
[11:57]  dale Cao: i need voice voice voice voice voice
[11:57]  Mo Miasma: i dont :P
[11:57]  Patchouli Woollahra: dale, shut up now!
[11:57]  Kylix Petit: Dale.. where are you sitting.. I need to mute you
[11:57]  Zjggy Stardust: they be magical, mystical, fantastical!
[11:58]  Inigo Chamerberlin: Excuse the lack of hair – one day soon it’ll arrive – maybe
[11:58]  Phoenix Psaltery: noooo
[11:58]  SunShine Kukulcan: Dale..there isnt gonna be any
[11:58]  Gwynnie Boffin: Dale, the problem is that you have too much voice atm
[11:58]  Wrestling Hulka: You can mute using Chat History..
[11:58]  dale Cao: i can tread voice voice voice voice voice voice voice
[11:58]  Brenda Maculate: Audio at all?
[11:58]  Digital Digital: lmao i was using the voice chat client and walked up on people having sex voice chat lol
[11:58]  Nicki Reisler: I like your avatar, Yoz :)
[11:58]  Nel Shan: Not til they can make me sound less like Kathy Bates and more like Audrey Hepburn
[11:58]  Zagro Ferraris: turn on the stream there talking
[11:58]  Zaphod Kotobide: .. /mode #pooley +mv Cory Linden
[11:58]  Brenda Maculate: I did. It craps out.
[11:58]  Jeska Linden shouts: Welcome to today’s Town Hall with Cory Linden. Today’s Town Hall is focused on technical issues within Second Life.
[11:58]  Notecard Writer: Dale STFU
[11:58]  Jeska Linden shouts: We’ll begin in just a few moments, first I wanted to take a minute and explain how this works.
[11:58]  Jesse Linden: please everyone
[11:58]  dale Cao: there is none
[11:58]  Jesse Linden shouts: shush
[11:59]  Wrestling Hulka: Heretic! I’ve never met you before
[11:59]  Heretic Linden: Wrestling! Nice to meet you.
[11:59]  Jeska Linden: Today’s Town Hall is Text Only –
[11:59]  Jeska Linden shouts: All questions should be submitted via the Linden Town Hall Questions group – the group has open enrollment, simply join and paste your question into the Group IM. Questions will be answered in the order they appear, duplicate questions and any technical support or individual support questions will be skipped.
[11:59]  Jeska Linden shouts: If you’d like to follow along with the Town Hall, please join the Linden Town Hall Closed Captioning Group, where we will be repeating the discussion.
[11:59]  Jeska Linden shouts: We will be posting a full transcript to the blog after the event, you may also want to read Cory’s Pre Town Hall blog post here:
[11:59]  Joshua Nightshade: zomg wrestling has FIC connections.
[11:59]  dale Cao: i can read
[12:00]  dale Cao: can’t read
[12:00]  Jeska Linden shouts: Also, please hold offers of friendship and IMs to Cory until after the event, as it can be disctracting!
[12:00]  SunShine Kukulcan: lawl@Joshua
[12:00]  Jeska Linden: Ok, Cory, take it away.
[12:00]  Zagro Ferraris: good cus i’m not sure if i got chat logging on :p
[12:00]  Brenda Maculate: Ellin, I can’t see!
[12:00]  Cory Linden shouts: Good afternoon, everybody… amazing to see so many avatars in one place
[12:01]  Davina Glitter shouts: I love you Cory
[12:01]  Cory Linden shouts: And I think since I put up the blog post we should go straight into questions
[12:01]  Joshua Nightshade: is this town hall going to be voice as well?
[12:01]  Zagro Ferraris shouts: Thank you cory i ben here since 6am :p
[12:01]  Melchoir Tokhes: 4 places.
[12:01]  tx Oh: its near 200
[12:01]  Jesse Linden: text only
[12:01]  Zagro Ferraris shouts: Is there a channel that only going to have what the lindens say ?
[12:01]  dale Cao: ican’t read
[12:01]  Mecha Dinosaur: It’s over 9000!
[12:01]  Cory Linden shouts: I know you will have a lot of them, so we’ll go through as many as we can
[12:02]  Joshua Nightshade: who should questions be sent to?
[12:02]  Jeska Linden: Faith Matova: somebody do me a favor and ask them at least why they’ve waited almost 2 years to upgrade to MySQL5?
[12:02]  Zaphod Kotobide: Josh: The town hall questions group
[12:03]  Cory Linden shouts: Because until very recently the performance limitations of MySQL 4.*’s multithreading
[12:03]  Cory Linden shouts: hasn’t been the high nail on performance
[12:03]  Kitty Barnett: (just set yourself busy, Linden chat overrides busy and filters out the chatter :) )
[12:03]  Cory Linden shouts: plus we wanted to make sure it was very stable before we switched
[12:03]  Cory Linden shouts: the process of upgrading is now ongoing, but will take time with 50+ MySQL instances running
[12:04]  Jeska Linden: Daaneth Kivioq: I wanted to konw – since it is clear that permromance issues are closely related to concurrent log ins, why throttling is not beeing used more agressively – i.e. – starting booting non-verifieds when the load gets high?
[12:05]  Cory Linden shouts: We’re trying to be careful about not using it too aggressively and building metrics to better know when to use it. The building of the metrics is ongoing.
[12:05]  Seven Shikami: Is the closed caption echo of the town hall working for anyone else? I’m not getting anything.
[12:05]  Ravanne Sullivan: nope
[12:05]  Ravanne Sullivan: not working
[12:05]  Ravanne Sullivan: par for the course
[12:05]  Nel Shan: Uh-uh
[12:06]  Jeska Linden: Wrestling Hulka: One of the problems I have with the client is the integration of the Mozilla framework for the browsers. From my estimate the inclusion of Mozilla has increased the size of the client download by at least 10MB and increased the memory leak. As of the current client there aren’t many instances where the internal browser is used, instead we are prompted to use an external browser. When can we expect all the external links be sent to the internal browser to justify the great size of the client, and memory leakage? I’m speaking specifically about the My Account History, Manage My Account, Scripting Guide, Scripting Portal, Official Linden Blog found on the Client menu. And if there are no plans to use the internal browser more efficiently, then what is the justification for having it?
[12:06]  Kylix Petit: not working here either *sighs*
[12:06]  Digital Digital: I sent a group question but received an error back
[12:06]  Cory Linden shouts: woah
[12:06]  Zagro Ferraris: Is there going to be some kind of monitor for the sandboxes now that live help is gone… There next to usles now for what there intended for.
[12:06]  Heretic Linden: Let’s focus on the question at hand, please.
[12:06]  Jamie David: Group IM not workie
[12:06]  Cory Linden shouts: As we have talked about in thepast, the integration of firefox has taken *way* longer than any of us expected
[12:06]  Joshua Nightshade shouts: Can someone repeat questions? The closed captioning group isn’t working for anyone.
[12:07]  Cory Linden shouts: we aren’t the only folks who have found this difficult and the good thing about firefox 2.0 is that they are working on making that process easier
[12:07]  Cory Linden shouts: we have an external team working on it as well, so our goal is to be doing a more significant release soon. However…
[12:07]  Celano Obscure mutters. “So don’t use FF.”
[12:08]  Cory Linden shouts: as I pointed out in the blog post, most of our development resources are focused on existing bugs and scaling, so firefox has been a bit starved for resources
[12:08]  Jeska Linden shouts: Kage Seraph: Cory, if you were a super hero, which would you want more, the mutant ability to scale things at will or the ability to make them more stable by the power of your mind?
[12:08]  Wrestling Hulka: sigh at that question
[12:09]  Alayna Hutson: are you kidding me?
[12:09]  Cory Linden shouts: scaling versus stability isn’t really a choice… I would want to do both
[12:09]  Allana Dion: oh cripes
[12:09]  Jamie David: Is this real????
[12:09]  Digital Digital: no one got mine :( figures
[12:09]  Samantha Poindexter closes her eyes and shakes her head.
[12:09]  Jeska Linden shouts: Rob Adelaide: What impact will the impending voice system have on the main grid as we know it now?
[12:09]  Ravanne Sullivan shouts: How about relevant questions and someone fix the CC group?!?
[12:09]  Notecard Writer: Yes
[12:09]  Cory Linden shouts: Since voice is using external servers for mixing and sends a very small stream to each client, the impact of on teh grid
[12:09]  You: There is a certain irony in that this town hall about technical problems is itself having technical problems. ;)
[12:10]  Zagro Ferraris shouts: i just got bumped out of the CC group
[12:10]  Zagro Ferraris shouts: i cant get back in
[12:10]  Cory Linden shouts: as a whole will be minimal from a scaling standpoint. From a use/business/community standpoint, the impact will be incredible…
[12:10]  Veeyawn Spoonhammer: cc group is working for me
[12:10]  Jamie David: IWhen are Group IM’s going to be fixed? Lets start off with that please?
[12:10]  Cory Linden shouts: we’ve been doing all our linden meetings in the voice client for a month+ and it is amazing how well it works…
[12:10]  Wrestling Hulka: Jamie – that’s answered in the blog I believe.
[12:10]  Heretic Linden: Jamie, please submit your questions to the group Linden Town Hall Questions.
[12:10]  Sascha Vandyke: it was voted no for . sigh
[12:11]  Cory Linden shouts: in fact it has had a measurable impact on development, too, since multiple groups are doing their morning standup mtgs in the voice client as well.
[12:11]  Mecha Dinosaur: haha voice is a joke
[12:11]  Jeska Linden shouts: Sweet Valentine: Can we please have a way to back up our own inventorys things we buildto help with inventory load and losses? im not asking for backing up copy items just teh items we make ourselves and also what is being done about inventory losses there was a patch posted that they said was fixing this but people are still losing items daily ?
[12:11]  Jamie David: LOL
[12:11]  Joshua Nightshade: bwahahaha.
[12:11]  Allana Dion: it’s broken
[12:11]  Cory Linden shouts: Agree that backing up items you have full perms on is a good idea. We really feel it is important to build that system in a way…
[12:12]  Cory Linden shouts: that scales and is robust enough to use more broadly. SL has suffered from rapidly deployed systems that we then have
[12:12]  Nyx Divine: yeah Sweet would hate to lose all those freebies she sells
[12:12]  Cory Linden shouts: to rely on for years and years –XML-RPC for example — so this isn’t a quick fix. Would like to work on it in Q3, however.
[12:12]  Jeska Linden shouts: Katie Welles: As you’re working to fix “Search” — can you do something about “abuse of key words?”
[12:13]  Celano Obscure: Well great. Nearly of my most valuable items, the costly ones I treasure most, are NOT full perm. So that helps me how?
[12:13]  Jolene McMillan shouts: i got in! :D
[12:13]  moo Money: clear your cache and restart
[12:13]  Cory Linden shouts: We are starting on a major reworking of search in SL. We’ve talked in the past about how search in sl is a different problem than on the web…
[12:13]  moo Money: it seriously helps
[12:13]  Celano Obscure: I mean, I really couldn’t care less about the junk I made. It’s just’s that. Junk. I could make it again in five seconds.
[12:14]  Samantha Poindexter: Celano: read the blog. Supposedly that’s one of the things they’re trying to work out. The questioner confined this to full-perm, not Cory.
[12:14]  Cory Linden shouts: but we think we have a good approach that will be more resilient to simple spam-based attacks. More details as the design is refined.
[12:14]  Jeska Linden shouts: Digital Digital: I would like to know whyat are we supposed to do when we lose such an expensive item in second life for example I bought a slingo machine for 16KL and it’s gone, I have tried everything also reported it many times and never get a responce back in e-mail or anything.
[12:14]  Heretic Linden: Celano, please confine your questions to the group Linden Town Hall Questions.
[12:14]  Celano Obscure: I don’t have anything lost right now. I just have a few expensive avs I’d hate to see disappear forever the way some folks have.
[12:14]  Alayna Hutson: heh, try calling the tech support… I still haven’t got a response months later
[12:14]  Khamon Fate shouts: You’re going to have to shout if you’re talking to us Heretic.
[12:14]  moo Money: jesus christ, you guys are freaking out more than I did and I lost my entire inventory
[12:14]  moo Money: *which I got back
[12:15]  Nyx Divine: wonderful Moo!
[12:15]  Samantha Poindexter: Ooh, you did, Moo? Yay!
[12:15]  Wrestling Hulka: solution: Be a blog writer for SLI
[12:15]  Sascha Vandyke: great, the group for questions is not working any longer
[12:15]  Zagro Ferraris: i keep loosing bit’s of my inventory aswell
[12:15]  Zagro Ferraris: so far nothing to inportent
[12:15]  Zagro Ferraris: i try to keep my inportent stuff moving around so it stays fresh
[12:15]  Cory Linden shouts: As is spelled out in the terms of service, you do create content at your own risk in SL. We are making every effort to reduce that loss and I am sorry that it has occurred…
[12:15]  moo Money: oh don’t even pull that
[12:15]  moo Money: let the man speak
[12:16]  Digital Digital: lmao
[12:16]  Zagro Ferraris: we need a BANK style invenotry system where you can store longterm unused items in it
[12:16]  Inigo Chamerberlin: Ah… FU, got it :-)
[12:16]  Cory Linden shouts: and numerous recent releases are directly addressing underlying stresses and scaling issues in inventory and assets.
[12:16]  Phoenix Psaltery: SHHH!
[12:16]  Alayna Hutson: Next time, hope that your credit card information gets lost and you don’t have to pay for your premium account anymore…
[12:16]  Jeska Linden shouts: Kylix Petit: Where does stability and performance fall in the priorites for LL development…. There is a problem literally every other day and it seems like there is VERY much room for improvement in this regard.
[12:16]  Alayna Hutson: oh wait, nvm, won’t ever happen.
[12:16]  Digital Digital: it’s ok they dont care they got their money for me buying the 16KL
[12:16]  Cory Linden shouts: As I spoke about in the blog post, 69% of the development staff at LL are currently on scaling and stability…
[12:16]  Digital Digital: maybe reverse credit card charges?
[12:16]  Jamie David: lets all have a party
[12:17]  Kitty Barnett: other residents get your money, not LL
[12:17]  Nyx Divine: 69% even? :)
[12:17]  Mecha Dinosaur: I’d perfer over 9000
[12:17]  Cory Linden shouts: and that percentage is rising over the next few weeks. It is the highest priority and the focus of the majority of our design, coding, and QA work.
[12:17]  Heretic Linden: Please stick to the question at hand. Direct your other questions to Linden Town Hall Questions, please.
[12:17]  Gwynnie Boffin: guys, shush, let them answer please
[12:17]  Fart Binder: lol QA ..
[12:17]  Cory Linden shouts: We are also working on the next gen architecture to allow far more scaling thean the current design.
[12:17]  Jeska Linden shouts: Vienna James: I am concerned about releases that have blatant issues, why are they being missed in Beta?
[12:18]  Fart Binder: Instead of getting better things are going to get more worth …
[12:18]  Fart Binder: worse*
[12:18]  Mecha Dinosaur: Because hardly anyone uses Beta.. because the beta sims are so slow…
[12:18]  Cory Linden shouts: Many problems only appear when we hit high load. Part of the solution to this is better synthetic testing, but the beta grid exists for people to expose problems…
[12:18]  Zjggy Stardust: shhhhhhhhhhh
[12:18]  Nyx Divine: yup need more BETA testers :)
[12:18]  Zagro Ferraris: Vienna Go to beta and help us find them … beta so barron of folks
[12:18]  Cory Linden shouts: You can all help by exploring the beta grid and posting bugs and repro cases to the public jira.
[12:18]  Zagro Ferraris: nyx come join me in beta
[12:18]  PetGirl Bergman: as i cant write in the question group: when aregroup notises began to work properly aggain? I cant even start a conversation in my own group more…
[12:18]  Jeska Linden shouts: Lewis Nerd: When can we expect to see “Traffic” removed? It serves no purpose, is entirely inaccurate and gamed, and most likely adds to many other problems we have
[12:19]  Mecha Dinosaur: That would require the beta not be lagtastic
[12:19]  Nyx Divine: :)
[12:19]  Joshua Nightshade: Lewis stole my question. -.-
[12:19]  Alayna Hutson: amen to that question
[12:19]  Cory Linden shouts: Removing the current traffic metric is part of the new search project, so the goal is to pull it as soon as possible.
[12:19]  Imogen Saltair shouts: Hear Hear!!!!
[12:19]  Zagro Ferraris: Mecha ever go in beta any time other than a main grid down for maintenince
[12:19]  Zagro Ferraris: i go in all the time becos its faster
[12:19]  Wrestling Hulka: Lewis stole my first born :(
[12:19]  Jeska Linden shouts: Spank Lovell: I’d like to ask what Quality control measures LL has in place to police the testing and release of both client updates and patches the the SL client and backend systems. It seems to me that each release introduces issues or breaks previously stable features?
[12:20]  Patchouli Woollahra: hangs in there at least one hour a week. often much more.
[12:20]  Heretic Linden: Zagro, please confine your questions to Linden Town Hall Questions.
[12:20]  Alayna Hutson: another amen, especially breaking stable stuff!
[12:20]  Cory Linden shouts: As I mentioned, the challenge with a system as complex as SL is testing w/o full load. As we continue to builkd out the dev team…
[12:20]  Mecha Dinosaur: Yes I have gone to beta to test out things.. and it’s lagtastic.. sim crossings usually result in a crash.. and I won’t even talk about how unstable the voice client is.
[12:20]  Cory Linden shouts: We will be working on better synthetic tests and benchmarks. In addition, nearly all new/refactored code is being …
[12:21]  Maverick Miasma: beta works better than main for me…
[12:21]  Cory Linden shouts: written with unit tests, whcih help. But the best way for you all to help make SL better is to use the beta grid and report repro cases when you find them.
[12:21]  Flight Band: All Go
[12:21]  Jeska Linden shouts: Cedric Boyd: Since i’m not getting any answer from the support concerning this question: when will the map be updated again? The last map from the sim i live on was up2date about four weeks ago. Live Help didn’t answer to my question and the support still not too ;) .
[12:21]  Starr Sonic: For those who know peeps who can’t get into the sim.. this is streaming live on
[12:21]  Mecha Dinosaur: The voice beta client crashed 48 out of 50 times for me. .most amuzing.
[12:21]  Fart Binder shouts: Unit Tests is not testing!
[12:21]  Alayna Hutson: if LL wants more people to go to the grid, they better start providing incentives
[12:21]  Allana Dion: can’t ask questions in the group, keep getting error message
[12:22]  Patchouli Woollahra shouts: it is so!
[12:22]  Alayna Hutson: *beta grid
[12:22]  Patchouli Woollahra shouts: Qualitative testing is testing!
[12:22]  Starr Sonic: Hey Rb
[12:22]  PetGirl Bergman: ..
[12:22]  Fart Binder shouts: There can be still bugs if you don’t use human testing with protocolls and stuff!
[12:22]  Nyx Divine: alayna, having a viable game is incentive enuf for me
[12:22]  Cory Linden shouts: We know about the bug and it is actively being worked on. We will try to provide more details after the meeting.
[12:22]  Patchouli Woollahra shouts: Hence the invite to beta grid
[12:22]  Heretic Linden: Please allow Cory to speak and confine your comments for the time being.
[12:22]  Veeyawn Spoonhammer: Alayna, you need an incentive to help make the end product better?
[12:22]  Fart Binder shouts: Every bigger company, and yours is big enough, has an own testing appartment!
[12:22]  Alayna Hutson: doesn’t matter… no one is going to the beta gird and incentives will help pull people in to help where needed.
[12:23]  Zagro Ferraris: i gave up on the questions group
[12:23]  PetGirl Bergman: me to i cant write in it
[12:23]  Jeska Linden shouts: Sascha Vandyke: Can’t the patches be tested on a beta grid, because they always render the whole sim unstable?
[12:23]  Gwynnie Boffin: Fart, are you here to talk or listen?
[12:23]  Patchouli Woollahra: Eh, he’s heare to fart.
[12:23]  Nyx Divine: a beta grid? WTF is that? hehe
[12:23]  Cory Linden shouts: Patches are tested on the beta grid, but often times bugs do not appear until full load testing.
[12:23]  Jeska Linden shouts: Duckling Kwak: Is the explosive land expansion a factor impacting grid performance? If yes, has LL evaluated other alternatives to managing the rising cost of land? The increased land has had a modest impact on land prices. If it’s costing SL more in performance, it’s not a worthwhile tradeoff.
[12:24]  Cory Linden shouts: Not really. There are a couple of load points related to sim count, but one of them was removed last week and the other is being designed away.
[12:25]  Jeska Linden shouts: Nite Zelmanov: Does the new search functionality being worked on include the discontinuation of traffic based rankings to illiminate the camping/bot impact of people gaming that system?
[12:25]  PetGirl Bergman: as i cant write in the group i ask here sorry: when wil large groups be able to send outnotices again – mine are over 1000 and have stopped working
[12:25]  Jamie David: ditto!!!!!
[12:25]  Cory Linden shouts: Traffic was our first attempt to create relevance ranking and it clearly is imperfect at the best of times….
[12:25]  Nite Zelmanov shouts: Jeska, he already answered that questions!
[12:25]  Nite Zelmanov shouts: FFS
[12:26]  Cory Linden: we’re pretty confident that we can generate better relevance ranking using other approaches.
[12:26]  Callipygian Christensen: :etgirl- we sent one successfully today to a group of over might just have been a miracle though
[12:26]  Cory Linden shouts: we’re pretty confident that we can generate better relevance ranking using other approaches.
[12:26]  Ravanne Sullivan shouts: Please, no redundant questiions!
[12:26]  Joshua Nightshade shouts: nite: No he didn’t. Simply deleting traffic won’t get rid of camping. They game it for popular places.
[12:26]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please direct your questions to the group Linden Town Hall Questions.
[12:26]  Jeska Linden shouts: Rita Cummings: Is there any project about improving Sound in Sl? Your sound component seems to capable of much more then what the current functions allow as to do. Will you expose more functionality in the near future?
[12:27]  Jamie David: Heritic we can’t, We try
[12:27]  Ravanne Sullivan shouts: The questions grop as well as the CC group are not working!
[12:27]  Cory Linden shouts: Voice is going to generate a lot of new music and audio options.
[12:27]  Cory Linden shouts: and our effort is there more than other audio features.
[12:27]  Celano Obscure: Indeed. The CC group hasn’t popped up for me yet.
[12:28]  Cory Linden shouts: but sound bugs are going into public jira nad the studio focusedon bugs will look at them.
[12:28]  Wrestling Hulka: CC group is not in use because this is a non-voice town hall.
[12:28]  Wrestling Hulka: thought that was obvious :X
[12:28]  Jeska Linden shouts: Chaos Mohr: What is being done to address land database issues which result in things such as parcels being paid for and not transferring, parcels being sold to multiple people etc? This seems to be a major technical issue which keeps cropping up and hasn’t been fixed yet.
[12:28]  Celano Obscure: Yeah, but not everyone can cram in this sim. There might be peopple on the outside who’d like to know what’s going on.
[12:28]  Heretic Linden shouts: A copy of this Town Hall transcript will be posted on the blog.
[12:28]  Wrestling Hulka: ^ what he said
[12:28]  Cory Linden shouts: These are likely symtpoms of the broader stresses on the central db and transactions..
[12:29]  PetGirl Bergman: i get a not etelling me i am not allowed to write questions…
[12:29]  Ravanne Sullivan: CC group was supposed to mirror chat
[12:29]  PetGirl Bergman: sorry
[12:29]  Cory Linden shouts: as I mentioned int he blog post, we are attacking these problems in two ways, to first identity weak spots in the current system and to build a better transaction system as well.
[12:29]  Jeska Linden shouts: Robaato Yoshikawa: do MySQL instances are load balanced, or the architecture is based on only assigning different server to residents, if the answer is no, have LL looked at tools like Sequoia:
[12:30]  Cory Linden shouts: Right now the different residents go to different servers. Ops will get the sequoia pointer, but more broadly we want to go a more scalable architecture long term. More details on that very soon.
[12:31]  Jeska Linden shouts: Magi Merlin: What focus are you putting into improving pre-release testing in order to reduce our pain?
[12:31]  Nite Zelmanov shouts: Jeska FFS
[12:31]  Ravanne Sullivan shouts: ASked and answered already!
[12:31]  Cory Linden shouts: We’ve hit this one a few times. It is the majority of our design work, we post all potential code to Beta grid, and we hope that more of you hit the beta grid to test it.
[12:32]  Alayna Hutson: come on, question asked, question answered, repeats = wasted time
[12:32]  Jeska Linden shouts: Sharrah Brendel: What about the loss of live has been inpossible to contact a live person in SL for over two weeks. I have left 5 tickets and never heard a word…Where have all the Lindens gone?
[12:32]  Heretic Linden: Please confine your comments to Linden Town Hall Discussion.
[12:32]  Patchouli Woollahra starts humming ‘where have all the cowboys gone’.
[12:32]  Simon Pulford shouts: working at stability issues :D
[12:32]  Gwynnie Boffin shouts: that’s all in the blog, too
[12:33]  Cory Linden shouts: There’s an extensive blog post about that, will post into chat in a moment.
[12:33]  Allana Dion shouts: We can’t Heretic, it’s broken, all we get is an error message when we try to ask a question
[12:33]  Torley Linden:
[12:33]  Torley Linden:
[12:33]  PetGirl Bergman: But if It doent work to write there wahte shal I DO? Heretic Linden: Please confine your comments to Linden Town Hall Discussion.
[12:33]  Torley Linden: ^ See those blog posts for more details.
[12:33]  Jeska Linden shouts: Keiki Lemieux: I often have upset customers who have lost animations or other no copy items when trying to transfer them from their inventory to a HUD. Other customers have lost their HUD altoghether. Since yesterday’s update, I’ve had 3 customers contact me with inventory loss issues. Two questions, 1) Is there a particular resource that I can point someone to who is experiencing inventory loss issues, like a page in the wiki? and 2) If you are noticing inventory loss after users attempt to move items in a particular way, can you provide a list of suggestions that I can pass on to my customers to avoid inventory loss?
[12:33]  Sascha Vandyke: close the group and reopen the im
[12:33]  Zagro Ferraris: ok i’ve tried asking this in questions 12 times and keep getting error’s
[12:33]  Gwynnie Boffin: also in the blog
[12:34]  Zagro Ferraris: Are we going to have some kind of help with greefing in the public sandboxes since thers no more live help. and :) when do we see the first sculpties in beta.
[12:34]  Cory Linden shouts: There are inventory related bugs on the public jira, also we have been putting a lot of code into QA to address some of thos eproblems. For more details, see blog post on transactions.
[12:35]  Jeska Linden shouts: tx Oh: q1) i still can’t modify scripts in group deeded object but i alowed to edit them. q2) if i change objects inventory, it takes a lot of time to get it updated. q3) the read from notecards is very slow. WHY?
[12:35]  Torley Linden shouts: Public JIRA Issue Tracker –
[12:35]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please confine your comments to Linden Town Hall Discussion.
[12:35]  Kitty Barnett: (abuse reports for that, Zagro)
[12:35]  Cory Linden shouts: On specific bugs, please make they are in the public jira issue tracker, please add specific repro cases if you have them, and the studio focused on current bugs will be able to hit them.
[12:36]  Jeska Linden shouts: Nel Shan: How do the Lindens feel about the Open Letter Project, and what it implies about the state of Linden/resident communications?
[12:36]  Texas Timtam: (Live coverage of this town meeting at
[12:36]  Cory Linden shouts: I can’t speak for all Lindens, but as I mentioned in the blog post, I thought that it did a good job of coalescing issues into one thread.
[12:37]  Jeska Linden shouts: Synack Fitzgerald: has LL considered migrating to a database that scales better that mysql and pays more attention to data integrity (postgresql is free, but oracle or db2 would be viable options as well)?
[12:37]  Cory Linden shouts: We don’t want to work on a model where we attempt to scale a central db. Instead, the effort is to build out a more scalable architecture.
[12:37]  Zi Ree: why.. noscript work noscript area? :P
[12:38]  Cory Linden shouts: And MySQL master->slave->slave setusp we use are quite reliable.
[12:38]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please direct all questions to the group Linden Town Hall Questions.
[12:38]  tx Oh shouts: decentralisation is the way to go
[12:39]  Jeska Linden shouts: Kymber Schnook: The blog indicates that LL will provide an exporter for Maya for the creation of sculpted prims. The range of pricing for different versions of Maya runs from $2,000 to $7,000 USD. Will you make available a more affordable means of export at the time of introduction of the sculpted prim?
[12:39]  Nite Zelmanov shouts: There there a linden clever enough to boot the spammy objects? Thanks!
[12:39]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please direct your comments to the group Linden Town Hall Discussion.
[12:39]  Wrestling Hulka: There is a free personal usage Maya client I believe ^^
[12:40]  Cory Linden shouts: I agree that only being able to export from Maya is suboptimal. We expect other exporters to be written and someone could take the open source client and build an editor there as well.
[12:40]  Jeska Linden shouts: Cay Trudeau: Do you think arranging physichal server on other continents, like Europe for instance, would ease up on the server load, ease the connections and allow better performance for European residents? Would that also lift the load from sending texture data across the wire?
[12:40]  Kitty Barnett: uhm :(
[12:40]  Cory Linden shouts: We absolutely want to deploy servers overseas. We have an architectural quirk in how we talk to the dbs — a layer of single threaded dataservers –
[12:41]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please keep in mind that a transcript of this Town Hall will be available.
[12:41]  Cory Linden shouts: that would suffer in situations with greater ping latency, so we need to fix that problem first, whcih is being worked on.
[12:41]  Cory Linden shouts: once that is fixed, we will begin international deployments. This is critical since over 65% of our use is from outside the US.
[12:42]  Jeska Linden shouts: Daisy Beauchamp: regarding 1.15 and graphic cards in laptops not working: 1. Why is it inconsistent? Why can I login and stay logged in for hours after 5-10 attempts? 2. Will SL ever support other graphic cards, or should I consider selling my Island and counting my losses? 3. Is it possible to use an older version of SL if you have issues?
[12:42]  Wrestling Hulka: Solution: Servers in Space :D
[12:43]  Cory Linden shouts: Laptop drivers are still an issue for all highperformance 3D applications. Over time, they are improving, but not as quickly as any of us would like.
[12:43]  Cory Linden shouts: We are discussing how to drive the client onto both higher and lower end cards, but right now more development is on system wide scaling.
[12:43]  Jeska Linden shouts: Doc Nielsen: What we are asking for is that these problems are addressed immediately, ahead of new features, and that we are able to see tangible improvements. Are you going to do this – yes or no?
[12:43]  Mo Rocco: Why have I not gotten any response in my request to increase my Lindex Limits?
[12:43]  Veeyawn Spoonhammer: Nice work, good coverage
[12:44]  Cory Linden shouts: As I previously mentioned — and was in the blog post — 69% of development is currently on bugs and scaling. That number will increase this month as we continue to hire.
[12:44]  Marilyn Murphy is gonna have docs baby
[12:45]  Kitty Barnett sighs at a sim restart in the middle of a town hall :(
[12:45]  Cory Linden shouts: Also, this is a good time to remind folks, we are hiring developers aggressively, including offices in Seattle, Boston, and all over the Bay Area.
[12:45]  Zi Ree: me can move ..there :P
[12:45]  Ruud Lathrop shouts: But not in Europe
[12:45]  Brett Finsbury: fantastic
[12:45]  Cory Linden shouts: Plus, we will always look at smart folks anywhere in the world since SL is working quite well for distributed software development. Oh, Brighton, too!
[12:45]  Fart Binder: Ruud yeah ^^
[12:45]  Jeska Linden shouts: Sam Stork: Will there ever be a good IDE? Two seperate clients for example, which would make things a lot easier for everyone?
[12:45]  Ruud Lathrop shouts: Yeah
[12:46]  Fart Binder: I don’t count UK as Europe :p *hides*
[12:46]  Fart Binder: just kidding
[12:46]  Fart Binder: ^^
[12:46]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please confine your comments to the group Linden Town Hall Discussion.
[12:46]  Cory Linden: We are starting the design process for making the UI even more end-user customizable. Plus it is open source, so I think the answer is yes, but scaling/stability is more important right now.
[12:47]  Jeska Linden shouts: Thorian Pennell: I would like to know if it’ll be possible for group owners to limit chat ability of members?
[12:47]  Alayna Hutson: Next time Heretic says that, I’m getting 100 000 linden dollars
[12:47]  Cory Linden shouts: Voice chat within groups is on the roadmap, so yes.
[12:47]  Jeska Linden shouts: Sascha Vandyke: If there’s a database issue and deployment problem, why don’t you put a time limit on free accounts?
[12:47]  Alayna Hutson: oooh good idea
[12:48]  Phoenix Psaltery: Must say I agree
[12:48]  tx Oh shouts: no voice chat on linux scheduled
[12:48]  Alayna Hutson: It would probably put the citizen count down closer to 2 million so they won’t do it.
[12:48]  Cory Linden shouts: We actually had time limits long, long, long, LONG ago. The problem is that people take a while to learn to use SL, plus great events or builds often bring folks back in weeks/months/years down the road.
[12:49]  Alayna Hutson: too bad for them. database issues are more important than someone having to make a new account to revisit SL.
[12:49]  Cory Linden shouts: It would be bad for all of our businesses to lose that ability for casual users to come back in. Plus, as we have discussed, free accounts are less of the load than you might expect.
[12:49]  Lexa Pro: can someone who can get into the questions group pass this one on, credited to Lexa Pro? “The recent Group IM bugs and resultant chat flooding highlighted an issue that several residents I’ve spoken with and I would like to see resolved. Is any thought being given to allowing users to toggle Group IMs on/off on a per-group basis, giving us the freedom to avoid the noisier group chats while still being able to keep tabs on groups that interest us?”
[12:49]  Notecard Writer: Oh PLEASE
[12:49]  Jeska Linden shouts: Alexandra Rucker: When will groups truly be fixed? I had to relog 3 times to see the town hall QUESTIONS group, and people still can’t see what’s being pasted to the captions group?
[12:50]  Cory Linden shouts: That is a known bug in the public jira that is being worked on.
[12:50]  Luth Brodie: oh come on not the “businesses” card
[12:50]  Torley Linden: Groups IMs Not Working Properly on the Issue Tracker –
[12:50]  Jeska Linden shouts: Arguss Sleeper: Is it possible to have a “real time” sim status map so that when there is a rolling restart or issuses concerning the ability t0 use the full grid a person would know in advance where not to tp to?
[12:50]  Lexa Pro: ok, folks, i think we got it. =) thanks greho, melchoir. =)
[12:51]  Cory Linden shouts: We currently have an internal tool that does that. We eventually want to be expose portions of that functionality via webservices.
[12:51]  Jeska Linden shouts: PetGirl Bergman: when wil large groups be able to send outnotices again – mine are over 1000 and have stopped working?
[12:51]  Melchoir Tokhes: Dammit, Lexa, that one didn’t go in. Got an error.
[12:51]  Lexa Pro: melchoir: i saw it.
[12:51]  Melchoir Tokhes: :p I didn’t :)
[12:52]  Lexa Pro: and phoenix just got it through again, that i could see anyway.
[12:52]  Torley Linden: For many of these bugs, you can look them up on the Issue Tracker (Public JIRA) – Group Notices failing –
[12:52]  Lexa Pro: so let’s stop torturing them a sec. =)
[12:52]  Greho Otaared: It seems sometimes, the group throws an error, but catches the message
[12:52]  Jeska Linden shouts: Katrina Bekkers: since the Open Letter indeed HAD a follow-up from LL, is this *the* way to contact them from now on? since the undercutting of other venues to contact them (and no, a comments-disabled blog and an unresponsive support/tracker don’t count), you’re endorsing resorting to 2000+ residents signed petitions to make issues heard now?
[12:52]  Cory Linden shouts: What Torley said…
[12:52]  Phoenix Psaltery: Interesting – I didnt see mine go through
[12:52]  Kooky Jetaime: ((What did torley say??))
[12:53]  Melchoir Tokhes: It’s a question I’d really like to have an answer to.
[12:53]  Cory Linden shouts: In this case, since scaling and stability are the primary internal focus right now this was an excelletn opportunity for a conversation.
[12:53]  Notecard Writer tears his hair out
[12:53]  Harleen Gretzky: [12:52] Torley Linden: For many of these bugs, you can look them up on the Issue Tracker (Public JIRA) – Group Notices failing –
[12:53]  Alayna Hutson pats notecard on the back and gives him some glue for his hair
[12:53]  Cory Linden shouts: As the commuynity team has been bloggin about, there are various methods for contacting us and talking to Lindens, including office hours, etc.
[12:53]  Kooky Jetaime: (Thanks Harleen))
[12:53]  Notecard Writer: thanks Alayna
[12:53]  Heretic Linden shouts: Please chat in Linden Town Hall Discussion.
[12:53]  Imogen Saltair: so the answwer to us not being able to talk to you is ‘we are on it’ whatever it is
[12:54]  Jeska Linden shouts: tx Oh: over 90% open bug reports are unassigned. why?
[12:54]  Samantha Poindexter: Yay! Alayna wins L$100,000!
[12:54]  Alayna Hutson: score!! pay up, Heretic
[12:54]  Alayna Hutson holds her hands out
[12:54]  moo Money rolls her eyes at Alayna
[12:55]  Cory Linden shouts: Torley is on this, so we are trying to provide better feedback on when bugs are being worked on. Not all will show the specific Linden who is on it, but we will indicate thos we are on.
[12:55]  Phoenix Psaltery: Can we please keep unneccesary chatter to a minimum?
[12:55]  Jeska Linden shouts: Nel Shan: One of the major issues that comes up with inventory loss is the fact that there is no way to verify the loss. This leads to the impression that the Lindens believe that anyone complaining about inventory loss is trying to scam Linden Labs. As well as trying to reduce inventory loss, will there be a way of verifying it introduced?
[12:55]  Torley Linden shouts: Re: bug status, you can read the Issue Tracker instructions –
[12:55]  Torley Linden shouts: See the procedure and the bottom section about “WorkingOnIt Linden”
[12:55]  Cory Linden shouts: That’s a very good idea and I will pass it along to the people focused on the issues.
[12:56]  Jeska Linden shouts: BlckCobra Shikami: Are our bug reports and crash dumps taken serious and analysed or do you just wait 2 month and send an eMail (like today) asking wether the bug still matter? Does it make sense for us to send bug reports and crash dumps or do we betetr save our time on that?
[12:56]  Cory Linden shouts: Please start focusing that energy on the public jira. That is the best vector for demonstrating repeatable bugs and getting the data to the people working on the problems.
[12:57]  Jeska Linden shouts: tha Poindexter: Have you considered holding events in the beta grid for better testing? For instance, would it help if these Town Hall meetings were held on that grid?
[12:57]  Zi Ree: pile-ons
[12:57]  Jeska Linden: (that’s from Samantha Poindexter – sorry!)
[12:57]  Alayna Hutson: oooh, good idea
[12:57]  Samantha Poindexter: “tha Poindexter”?
[12:57]  Buckaroo Mu: DAMN GOOD IDEA!
[12:57]  Ravanne Sullivan giggles
[12:57]  Cory Linden shouts: We have in the past and will continue to do so in the future. Town halls there is a good suggestion.
[12:57]  Jeska Linden shouts: ascha Vandyke: After the update my island is unstable and support can’t find the issue. Will there be better debug tools coming to fix it?
[12:58]  Neovo Geesink: FULL…
[12:58]  Celano Obscure: No sorry. Too much of a bother. Best leave the crash-logger intact for now.
[12:58]  Phoenix Psaltery grin… that’s what we call you, Sam… “Teh Poindexter.”
[12:58]  Greho Otaared: (Sorry.. can someone tell my if my question is showing in the group?)
[12:58]  Samantha Poindexter giggles.
[12:58]  Cory Linden shouts: In the long run, we want to expose as many of the management and support tools we have for land to the residents so that you can provide better data back to us…
[12:58]  Cory Linden shouts: but that is going to take time.
[12:59]  Jeska Linden shouts: GreeterDan Godel: people are here expecting answers to their big questions. But it is clear that a lot of people’s big concerns don’t have immediate answers. Should people accept SL as it is and hope for slow change? Or is there reason to expect fundamental changes to the biggest problems any time soon?
[12:59]  Sascha Vandyke: did this region crash or only I
[12:59]  Kitty Burnett: sim restarted
[13:00]  Sascha Vandyke: lol
[13:00]  Gwynnie Boffin: we didn’t crash
[13:00]  Cory Linden shouts: The answer, of course, lies somewhere in between. We are working to fix bugs and enable incremental improvement. At the same time, we are…
[13:00]  Cory Linden shouts: building the foundations for the next gen architecture that will radically improve our ability to scale.
[13:00]  Neovo Geesink: Incredible… Not even a seat to occupie…
[13:01]  Cory Linden shouts: We also expect that some changes that might seem incremental, such as voice, will actually be transformative in terms of the avaialble design space for residents.
[13:01]  Geor Mizser: People need to realize that for the most part, this is the initial 3D/Virtual “world” available on this scale and they should accept that there are going to be problems along the way.
[13:01]  Jeska Linden shouts: Melchoir Tokhes: What’s the story with the Friends list and the online status indication? Can we expect to see (please) a way where we can check the online status and update the client side on a per-person basis?
[13:02]  Torley Linden shouts: Friends list not working on the Issue Tracker –
[13:02]  Celano Obscure: Except for all those people who won’t use voice….
[13:02]  Cory Linden shouts: My blog post went into some detail on this. In addition there are details on the public jira. Plus, we are continuing to roll out fixes to thsi system.
[13:03]  Luth Brodie: and those who will discriminate against those of us who wont use voice
[13:03]  Wigge Whitfield shouts: : As I have posted on the forum, PLEASE Address the Group IM issue, allowing group owners to DISABLE Group IMs or allowing users to choose not to receive them.. As we speak my group was being spammed, and due too the current bugs I couldnt chat in the group myself to address them, costing me ove 25 members.. PLEASE Address this problem for us business owners!
[13:03]  Jeska Linden shouts: Salazar Jack: What will have to happen to eliminate region crossing rubberbanding, for everything from simply walking across a region boundary to traveling between region in vehicles. Is there a way to make that seamless and unnoticeable?
[13:04]  Cory Linden shouts: As many of you know, the region crossing process involves packaging up the objects, scripts, script state and movin ghtem between physical machines…
[13:04]  Neovo Geesink: I will que up in this matter of Group IM… I, From Spinach Games have the same issue.
[13:04]  Nyna Slate: and thats a question going on since 2003
[13:04]  Cory Linden shouts: there are still some approaches available to us to mask that latency and I feel that we will be able to improve that a lot.
[13:04]  Cory Linden shouts: However, the resources to address that are currently on broader scaling/stability issues.
[13:04]  SunShine Kukulcan: OH PLEASE
[13:04]  Jeska Linden shouts: Michael Dale: Regarding teleporting, it is our only real method of travel within SL. It’s constant breakdowns hinder everyone’s ability to perform basic and routine functions within SL. When will this issue be addressed and corrected?
[13:05]  Cory Linden shouts: We are currently working on better metrics for detecting teleport issues and stomping out the bugs in the system.
[13:05]  Jeska Linden shouts: Phoenix Psaltery: How does LL plan to deal with urgent scaling issues through 3Q2007 as the concurrent logins continue to grow?
[13:05]  Wigge Whitfield shouts: JESKA LINDEN: : As I have posted on the forum, PLEASE Address the Group IM issue, allowing group owners to DISABLE Group IMs or allowing users to choose not to receive them.. As we speak my group was being spammed, and due too the current bugs I couldnt chat in the group myself to address them, costing me ove 25 members.. PLEASE Address this problem for us business owners!
[13:05]  Neovo Geesink: Can the flyspeed be increased so that one does not have to use the teleport system for ajacent regions, or nearby regions??
[13:06]  Samantha Poindexter: …how ironic. Wigge’s spamming chat to complain about spam in the groups.
[13:06]  Spaceman Opus: lo;
[13:06]  Blackpanther124 Clarke: lol
[13:06]  Cory Linden shouts: As the blog post talks about, most of the development effort is on those issues, plus the next gen architecture will enable us to achieve far larger scale than we can today.
[13:06]  Rob Adelaide: Neovo, aka noob, get a flight enhancer if that’s what you want
[13:06]  Cory Linden shouts: OK, last question…
[13:06]  Jeska Linden shouts: Radslns Hutchence: As residents, invested in making SL work, what can we do, in addition to being patient, to help with any of these initiatives?
[13:07]  Alayna Hutson: absolutely nothing because the lindens don’t listen to us
[13:07]  Cory Linden shouts: Patience obviously helps, but more than that, please help the community build the pieces it needs to make SL a better place…
[13:07]  Captain Noarlunga: wtg
[13:07]  Phoenix Psaltery rolls his eyes
[13:07]  Alayna Hutson: whoops, did I say that out loud?
[13:07]  Ken Serapis: Hello Scarlet! Remember me from the ITE?
[13:08]  Cory Linden shouts: If you are a programmer, contribute to the open source project or come work for us…
[13:08]  Rob Adelaide: Hey Ken!
[13:08]  Blackpanther124 Clarke: it is true in ways Alayna
[13:08]  Zi Ree: import me :P
[13:08]  Scarlett Qi: Hi Ken
[13:08]  Cory Linden: If you have bugs and can repro them, add data into thepublic jira…
[13:08]  Cory Linden shouts: If you have bugs and can repro them, add data into thepublic jira…
[13:08]  Captain Noarlunga: jira….lol
[13:08]  Cory Linden shouts: Help with the wiki and documentation…
[13:08]  Celano Obscure: See now, it’s much better to keep the harsher mocking to IM.;)
[13:08]  Ken Serapis: cory, What happened to the Help request?
[13:09]  Kooky Jetaime: ((Ken, read da blog))
[13:09]  Captain Noarlunga: need a damned degree to enter JIRA
[13:09]  Rob Adelaide: lol, Ken, you noob :P
[13:09]  Cory Linden shouts: Spend time helping out in the welcome areas and help island…
[13:09]  Rob Adelaide pokes Ken
[13:09]  Ken Serapis: Fine.. haha
[13:09]  Notecard Writer: And Info Island!
[13:09]  Spaceman Opus: warning newbies what they’re really in for is far different than what they read in their local newspaper
[13:09]  Brett Finsbury: thank you for taking the time to answer questions
[13:09]  Master Pye: OK Ill help out :-)
[13:09]  Salazar Jack: Thanks for the dialogue.
[13:09]  Celano Obscure: Don’t feel bad Captain. I know people with degrees who think Jira’s obtuse.
[13:09]  Cory Linden: As bill and ted would say, be excellent to each other.
[13:09]  Gwynnie Boffin: thanks a lot for having this, guys :)
[13:09]  Captain Noarlunga: lol
[13:09]  Edfud Shabazz: yes thx
[13:09]  Edfud Shabazz: :)
[13:09]  Digital Digital: lol
[13:09]  Greho Otaared grins
[13:10]  Fart Binder: Is there a way to get Debugging Symbols of your current Secondlife Viewer Builds to be abled tracking issues?
[13:10]  Kim Anubis: Thank you, Cory & all you fine Lindens :)
[13:10]  Cory Linden shouts: Thank you all very much for all the great questions.
[13:10]  Rob Adelaide: There will now be a brief autograph and photo op with the lindens…please make a single-file line to the right of the stage :P
[13:10]  Neovo Geesink: Thats a thing I choosed to do allso… Staying around on the Help Island… Lots of people with questions there…
[13:10]  Captain Noarlunga: so…bottom line…….it screwed up and it aint gonna work
[13:10]  Kooky Jetaime: ((I’ve had problems with Jira but oh well.. Guess theres no point in bug repping anymore.. and if thats the case, why not remove that button??))
[13:10]  Ken Serapis: haha
[13:10]  Digital Digital: lol
[13:10]  Blackpanther124 Clarke: lol
[13:10]  Melchoir Tokhes shouts: No no, thank you for all the great answer.s
[13:10]  tessa Amos shouts: thanks Lindens :)
[13:10]  Digital Digital: Thanks lindens! :)
[13:10]  moo Money: Thank you for taking out the time to address us, guys
[13:10]  Cory Linden shouts: I will be making blog posts about known issues more regularly as we move forward as well.
[13:10]  Jesse Linden: thanks everyone
[13:10]  Jeska Linden shouts: Thanks for coming to the Town Hall everyone. Please note the transcript from the Town Hall will be posted in the Blog.
[13:10]  Notecard Writer: Thanks Cory & the Lindens…
[13:10]  Jeska Linden shouts: That’s at
[13:10]  Steve Mahfouz shouts: Thanks Lindens for your time
[13:11]  Gwynnie Boffin: omg with the snapshots already
[13:11]  Kooky Jetaime: ((Can we have open comments?? it seems everything is closed comments anymore))
[13:11]  Edfud Shabazz: lol
[13:11]  Mildred Mapp: lol
[13:11]  Mo Rocco shouts: Could I get an answer to my question now Lindens? About why no one has contacted me about my Lindex Limits request?
[13:11]  Daisy Beauchamp: sighs
[13:11]  Cory Linden shouts: And as we will be talking in more detail about the next gen architecture, search, etc, soon.
[13:11]  Timeless Prototype: no flashes please ;)
[13:11]  Captain Noarlunga: lol
[13:11]  Cory Linden shouts: Thanks, everyone.
[13:11]  Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay on that, Cory :)
[13:11]  Luth Brodie: yes thank you for taking your time to deflect questions
[13:11]  Neovo Geesink: OK. Its a big plus th have such meetings! It is clearly clarifieng things, and gave us the chance to meet with the Lindens to talk.
[13:11]  Kooky Jetaime: ((Zero’s open office meetings are great for next gen archatecture))
[13:11]  Spaceman Opus: lol
[13:11]  Jesse Linden: now time to dance?
[13:11]  Captain Noarlunga removes hair and shoes from ass and goes home
[13:11]  tx Oh: use full text indexing would help!
[13:11]  Marilyn Murphy: not one thing has been fixed yet
[13:12]  CickMy Lunt: i am dancing in the floor
[13:12]  Zaphod Kotobide: Thank you cory and the rest..
[13:12]  ThumpieBunnyEve Hax shouts: If any Lindens know me or more importantly,”” Julia Wolf”” please contact me Vie IM after this event. I know one of you do! I’ve met you!
[13:12]  Ruud Lathrop shouts: Go do a little dance Jesse
[13:12]  Ruud Lathrop shouts: :)
[13:12]  Whack Oh: Thanks Cory and LL!
[13:12]  Zaphod Kotobide: now where’s the free beer?
[13:12]  Lexa Pro: ok, folks, i’ll be afterpartying here at heck: thanks for your time, lindens!
[13:12]  moo Money: and now we dance!
[13:12]  Blackpanther124 Clarke: wow i think i broke myself
[13:12]  tessa Amos shouts: woohoo Jesse
[13:12]  Spaceman Opus shouts: And, please….remember to keep communication open, Lindens!
[13:12]  Phoenix Psaltery opts for vodka
[13:12]  c0r3y Hax: so can someone bullet point this for someone who just arrived?
[13:12]  Jeska Linden: oh! i need a good dance animation….
[13:12]  Zagro Ferraris: thank you
[13:12]  Zagro Ferraris: byby
[13:12]  Neovo Geesink: I have subscribed to be a volunteer, so I will see when it is processed.
[13:12]  Celano Obscure: I wanna beer.
[13:12]  Timeless Prototype: hi Gwyn
[13:12]  Digital Digital: sorry if i run in to anyone i cant see where im going LMAO
[13:12]  CickMy Lunt: lol hay sebas :3
[13:13]  Gwynnie Boffin: hi Timeless :)
[13:13]  Ruud Lathrop shouts: wooot
[13:13]  Zagro Ferraris: wholy …… dont look behind me :p
[13:13]  Zagro Ferraris: lagtastick
[13:13]  Kooky Jetaime: guess its time to go huntin
[13:13]  Marilyn Murphy: basically a lot of talk about the swell new stuff coming our way and they are gonna work on the problems
[13:13]  Soft Noel shouts: YOU GO, JESSE!!! XD
[13:13]  tessa Amos shouts: get down jesse :P
[13:13]  Timeless Prototype: great spectator sport this is
[13:13]  Phoenix Psaltery: Bye, all
[13:13]  Jesse Linden: Ungh!
[13:13]  Digital Digital: lol now all we need is music hahahahahahaha
[13:13]  Lexa Pro: one more time, for the hearing impaired: ok, folks, i’ll be afterpartying here at heck: thanks for your time, lindens!
[13:14]  Thorvalld Barragar: Where be te’ afterparty?
[13:14]  Rob Adelaide: Hey, Timeless, you invented the ‘Multi-Gadget’, right?
[13:14]  Sebas Writer: oi, im getting super lag here
[13:14]  moo Money: Sebas!
[13:14]  Timeless Prototype: yes Rob
[13:14]  Sebas Writer: Strange Love
[13:14]  Neovo Geesink: Indeed tTimeless… There should be more of them in Sync. So there will be much les lag.
[13:14]  Jamie David: and here we see it
[13:14]  Digital Digital: *sings* celebrtate good times come on!
[13:14]  Jamie David: dancing in the steets
[13:14]  Rob Adelaide: where are you so I can punch you?
[13:14]  CickMy Lunt: hey guys look how many w-hats are here not griefing
[13:14]  ThumpieBunnyEve Hax: [] [] [] [] [] [] If any Lindens know me or more importantly,”” Julia Wolf”” please contact me Vie IM after this event. I know one of you do! I’ve met you! [] [] [] [] [] [] []
[13:14]  Jamie David: fluff, and danding
[13:14]  Digital Digital: lol
[13:14]  Timeless Prototype: hehe Rob, over here, right of stage
[13:14]  Blackpanther124 Clarke: lag lag
[13:14]  Astarte Artaud shouts: Well two crashes since I’ve been here and so far I have heard nothing other than a reiteration of what was posted in the blog reply to the open letter. I suppose I couldn’t ask for anything else
[13:14]  moo Money: Cick: that’s the kind of statement that calls attention to them and gets them banned
[13:15]  Ken Serapis: Right to my left :P
[13:15]  Amur Kuhn shouts: I LOVE THE LINDENS!!
[13:15]  Amur Kuhn shouts: I DONT KNOW WATS GOING ON BUT!!
[13:15]  Rob Adelaide: damn, you’re in another sim and I can’t cross
[13:15]  Kooky Jetaime watches his framerate climb as people dissapear
[13:15]  Jeska Linden: dance dance
[13:15]  Jeska Linden grins
[13:15]  Heretic Linden: Lol, Gwynnie.
[13:15]  CickMy Lunt: i suppose that is true
[13:15]  Heretic Linden moves.
[13:15]  Gwynnie Boffin: ;)
[13:15]  Spike Linden: Gwynnie!! haha
[13:15]  Timeless Prototype: lol
[13:15]  Jesse Linden: can’t. stop. dancin’.
[13:15]  Spike Linden: that is so bad, lol
[13:15]  Digital Digital: I have a new dance
[13:15]  Gwynnie Boffin: heh heh
[13:15]  Digital Digital: :P
[13:15]  Jamie David: this is the stuff of legends.
[13:15]  Timeless Prototype flips up his brollie – if the shit’s going to hit the fan
[13:15]  Melchoir Tokhes waks on your head.
[13:15]  Gwynnie Boffin: hey, i just capture the moments…
[13:15]  Kooky Jetaime: come on… give me 6…..
[13:16]  Digital Digital: lmao
[13:16]  Timeless Prototype: hi Tao
[13:16]  IrishCream Balboa: i take it the meeting is over?
[13:16]  Jeska Linden: boogie woogie

Mecha Construction in SL, Lesson 1

[11:54]  Jurgi Harlan: kage, I came to Second Life to design, pilot and sell mecha.
[11:54]  The Sojourner: Hi Xanshin
[11:54]  Jurgi Harlan: I believe you are my superior in this, and I wish to learn from you.
[11:55]  Xanshin Paz: hiya,
[11:55]  Xanshin Paz: Soj1
[11:55]  Xanshin Paz: jeez…..keybd impaired again
[11:55]  Xanshin Paz: hi guys!
[11:55]  You: I’d be happy to help you learn everything I know about mecha design. WHen would you like to begin?
[11:55]  Jurgi Harlan: At your convenience, I am a complete novice.
[11:55]  You: Hello, Xanshin
[11:56]  Jurgi Harlan: I am offering myself as apprentice, and intern.
[11:56]  Xanshin Paz: hello, Kage!
[11:56]  You: Well, if you have an hour or so, we could start right now, Jurgi.
[11:56]  Jurgi Harlan: I do.
[11:56]  The Sojourner: I will sit on the fence and write notecards
[11:57]  Jurgi Harlan: There, that got rid of the fur.
[11:57]  You: Great! Let’s have a seat and get a sense of what you already know.
[11:57]  Jurgi Harlan: Alright.
[11:57]  The Sojourner: Kage and I are good sitters
[11:58]  Jurgi Harlan: Apparently, I am not!
[11:58]  Kage Seraph dreams of the day when LL makes sitting a painless process.
[11:58]  Jurgi Harlan: Bah
[11:59]  Xanshin Paz: I’d pay to be a fly on this wall, but I’ve *got* to get some sleep :/
[11:59]  Jurgi Harlan: Nonetheless, what I know thusfar is slim.
[11:59]  Xanshin Paz: nice meeting you, guys
[11:59]  You: We can notecard the chat transcript, Xanshin, if everyone consents..?
[11:59]  Jurgi Harlan: I can show you my work, and it will say more than I can.
[11:59]  Xanshin Paz: oh, that’d be great !
[11:59]  Xanshin Paz: thanks!
[11:59]  Kage Seraph nods, no problem
[12:00]  Jurgi Harlan: These are the starting point of an idea I had…
[12:00]  Xanshin Paz: ‘nite, all……!
[12:00]  You: Night!
[12:00]  DragonChiq Thereian is online
[12:00]  Jurgi Harlan: You might not notice, but it is actually sized for your DIY kit.
[12:01]  Misty Rhodes is online
[12:01]  You: Intended as an attachment to the hips?
[12:01]  Jurgi Harlan: A pelvis attach…though eventually I planned to add actual moving treads.
[12:02]  Jurgi Harlan: This was my first attempt, disassembled for you.
[12:02]  Kage Seraph ponders. Shooting for a Madcat?
[12:02]  Jurgi Harlan: Feel free to get a closer look, and yes, I was basing my idea on a reverse knee Clan mech like a Mad Cat or Vulture.
[12:03]  You: Sounds good so far.
[12:03]  Jurgi Harlan: At the time, I hadn’t learned rescaling the whole model, so you’ll notice they’re too large.
[12:04]  Jurgi Harlan: For the DIY kit anyway.
[12:04]  You: Perhaps we could begin the discussion with animations and how they work in SL. They’re kinda the key concept in mecha design
[12:04]  Jurgi Harlan: Indeed, I have made animations in Avimator. Is that useful?
[12:05]  You: Yes, that is an excellent start (though I use Poser, so I can’t walk you through difficulties in Avimator directly)
[12:05]  Jurgi Harlan: That is what I have learned of particle effects.
[12:06]  Jurgi Harlan: The fly/follow effect is sadly copied from someone else’s work.
[12:06]  Jurgi Harlan: My goal was to keep the particles in the ball.
[12:06]  You: Looks good as a start, Jurgi.
[12:07]  Jurgi Harlan: It also makes a useful hands-free light source, when it’s not chasing pretty girls.
[12:07]  Kage Seraph grins
[12:07]  Jurgi Harlan: Well, I have one more work piece to show you.
[12:07]  You: Okay, rez it at will. =D
[12:08]  Jurgi Harlan: This was based off your Steam Golem design.
[12:08]  Jessica Qin is offline
[12:08]  DragonChiq Thereian is offline
[12:08]  Jurgi Harlan: It’s not done, but I was more trying to get the techniques you used down more than to copy every facet.
[12:09]  Jurgi Harlan: I hope my imitation didn’t offend.
[12:09]  You: Sure, it looks like you have a good eye for the forms involved
[12:09]  You: No, I have no problem with practicing that way.
[12:10]  Jurgi Harlan: I really like your Steam Golem as it gives you size, as well as maintaining a posable head which which conversations stay fluid.
[12:10]  You: Well, let’s use the Steam Golem as a conversation piece. We’ll pull it apart to see how it works, then put it back together as a complete piece.
[12:11]  Jurgi Harlan: At your leisure, sensei.
[12:11]  You: I’ll transplant the functional bits out of the anim overrider so we can concentrate on functionality, not form at this stage
[12:12]  Object: Loading notecard ‘*Default Anims’…
[12:12]  Object: Finished reading notecard. (4215 bytes free)
[12:13]  Ned Nolan: hello
[12:13]  Jurgi Harlan: So the invisiprims are on the feet, and the mech legs are on your lower legs, yes?
[12:13]  Ned Nolan: hi Soj
[12:13]  Higbee Protagonist is online
[12:14]  The Sojourner: Hi Ned.. working on something
[12:14]  You: Okay, as you saw before I attached the wooden box anim overrider, the attachments on the legs don’t determine the position of the av above the ground. Only the anim overrider does that
[12:14]  Bob Bunderfeld is offline
[12:14]  Jurgi Harlan: yes, I learned that, hence I was sizing my treads to match the overrider’s height limit.
[12:14]  You: So the legs can be arbitrarily short or long, and only have to extend to the ground if you’re shooting for a sense of realism. 😉
[12:14]  Jurgi Harlan: The code involved is completely unknown to me.
[12:15]  Zekeen Phoenix is online
[12:15]  You: In this case, I’ve integrated the invisiprims covering the mesh avatar’s calves and feet right into the lower legs of the prim av
[12:15]  Jurgi Harlan: Okay, give me a second there.
[12:15]  You: clarification in terms: mesh av = the regular human av almost all of us use
[12:16]  You: in my case, the mesh av is the one in jeans and a tee shirt
[12:16]  Jurgi Harlan: Okay, so those invisiprims are built into the legs, not separate attaches.
[12:16]  Zekeen Phoenix is offline
[12:17]  You: yes, though they could be separate attaches if you preferred to build it that way. I try to minimize the number of attachments used for sanity’s sake when tuning the av’s movement
[12:17]  Jurgi Harlan: Learning the exact function of invisiprims is going to be a lesson I will require.
[12:17]  You: Certainlyh, let’s handle that now.
[12:17]  Jurgi Harlan: Please do.
[12:19]  You: invisiprims use special textures to obscure any texture behind them by canceling the texture out. Some textures contain an extra “color” (called an alpha channel)
[12:19]  You: that programs like SL can interpret as transparency.
[12:19]  Jurgi Harlan: Alright, by “behind them” you mean contained within the prim’s area?
[12:20]  You: within and/or behind, the effect is the same. All that matters is which texture is encountered first when you sort them by distance from the SL client’s camera
[12:21]  You: so for me, the SL client camera is over and behind my shoulder
[12:21]  Jurgi Harlan: Well, I notice that when the mech’s leg is behind the invisiprim, it is not being obscured.
[12:21]  You: Very astute.
[12:21]  Jurgi Harlan: How is the prim discerning betwixt your foot, and the mech’s knee?
[12:22]  Jurgi Harlan: I also notice -I- am being obscured by them.
[12:22]  You: SL is mercifully set up such that textures that do NOT contain an alpha channel are not obscured by textures that DO contain an alpha channel
[12:22]  Jurgi Harlan: And my staff is not.
[12:22]  You: so, for this application we have two kinds of textures, alpha textures and non-alpha textures
[12:22]  Jurgi Harlan: Alright…
[12:23]  You: alpha textures obscure (hide) each other, and non-alpha textures of course obscure both alpha and non-alpha textures behind them.
[12:23]  Jurgi Harlan: I see.
[12:23]  You: so, it follows that the rusty textures on the mecha’s legs are non-alpha, and the textures on you and me are alpha textures
[12:23]  Jurgi Harlan: How can we manipulate what possesses the alpha channel state, and what does not?
[12:24]  DragonChiq Thereian is online
[12:24]  You: alpha channels can be added to any image in an offline image editor such as Adobe Photoshop or GIMP
[12:24]  You: Numerous excellent tutorials are on the web to do this.
[12:25]  You: Also,
[12:25]  Jurgi Harlan: I will acquire them.
[12:26]  You: when we change the transparency in the object editing toolbox (“Texture” tab, “Transparency” box), SL forces the texture in question to have an alpha channel
[12:26]  Jurgi Harlan: Even if we reset it to 0%?
[12:27]  You: Setting it to zero removes the alpha channel from a texture that was originally non-alpha to begin with.
[12:27]  Jurgi Harlan: Ah, I see.
[12:27]  Jurgi Harlan: I believe I have a functioning grasp of the concept.
[12:27]  You: Good! Let’s move on to the next brain-bender.
[12:28]  You: As it turns out, you and I and Soj each have two representations here on the inworld grid
[12:28]  Jurgi Harlan: Our location and our avatar.
[12:28]  You: First, the avatar that we all know and love and can see
[12:29]  You: Second, as you mentioned, our position is analogous to the agent representing each of us
[12:29]  Jurgi Harlan: yes, agent, the term had escaped me.
[12:29]  Jurgi Harlan: It is the agent by which we “play”, seeing and moving.
[12:29]  Jurgi Harlan: The avatar becomes merely the visual placemarker for the agent.
[12:30]  You: Most of the time, the agent and avatar can be used interchangeably. But there are a few crucial differences.
[12:30]  You: Yes, you’ve nailed it.
[12:30]  Jurgi Harlan: I have studied some, sensei.
[12:30]  You: The camera and collision detection are tied to the agent, NOT the avatar, and it is this distinction that makes giant mecha in SL possible
[12:31]  You: i.e., if we use an animation to move the apparent location of the avatar (for giant mecha, we move it straight up, no?), the agent’s position does not change.
[12:31]  Jurgi Harlan: Indeed.
[12:32]  Jurgi Harlan: We continue to interact with terrain, despite being above the ground.
[12:32]  You: that is, it stays on the ground. So, where is my agent right now?
[12:32]  Jurgi Harlan: Because our agent is at ground level.
[12:32]  You: true true
[12:32]  Jurgi Harlan: I have a question.
[12:33]  You: So, all of that to say that as you construct animations and later prim models,always remember where the av is and where the agent is.
[12:33]  You: Yes?
[12:33]  Jurgi Harlan: If our agent is on the ground, how does the avatar look correctly when I focus my vision below me by bending over?
[12:33]  You: Losing track of the relative positions in agent and av leads to some pretty glaring animation issues. =)
[12:34]  Jurgi Harlan: Allow me to visualize my question.
[12:34]  Jurgi Harlan: Now, I am starting at Soj.
[12:34]  Jurgi Harlan: My agent is at ground level.
[12:35]  Jurgi Harlan: Why does my head tilt down?
[12:35]  The Sojourner: soj waves
[12:35]  Jessica Qin is online
[12:36]  You: This is one case where LL did excellent bookkeeping.
[12:37]  Jurgi Harlan: So their systems manage it inherently?
[12:38]  You: Recall that the avatar is not fully tied to the agent, so each of our clients can calculate the proper avatar articulation regardless of where the agent is, that is, the av’s position and orientation are handled relative to the agent, but the algorithms
[12:39]  You: that determine head facing and foot facing in particular, are handled separately. That way, your feet are properly angled onto the ground and you can look about naturally regardless of most animations( i.e., animations that do not take over the head)
[12:39]  Jurgi Harlan: I see.
[12:39]  You: Other questions before we move on to articulation?
[12:40]  Jurgi Harlan: So this is not an issue we must constantly correct when building a mech with a poseable head.
[12:40]  You: that is correct. LL has done a good job formalizing how an unconstrained head should act. =)
[12:40]  Jurgi Harlan: I think I have a grasp of it, sensei, please move along if you are ready.
[12:41]  You: Okay, on to articulation.
[12:42]  You: The root of the magic in the animation here is to set the hips in the animation upward into the air as appropriate. The position and overall orientation of the avatar are determined thus:
[12:42]  You: get the position and rotation of the agent, add the effect of the active animation(s) to that, then display
[12:43]  You: As you know one can have multiple animations playing simultaneously, as when we are standing and typing at once
[12:43]  Lazarus Bogan is offline
[12:43]  Jurgi Harlan: Yes.
[12:44]  You: So, SL combines the animations mathematically and drops any subset of the animations that are of a lower priority that the highest-priority animation, as well as non-animated bodyparts.
[12:44]  You: another way to say that:
[12:44]  Jurgi Harlan: My staff overriding my left hand while I type, for example.
[12:45]  You: a priority 4 animation (the mecha standing animation) negates the default standing animation for all joints that the mecha animation takes control of
[12:45]  Jurgi Harlan: Ah, my slouching animation is a priority 4…can you teach me of the priorities?
[12:45]  You: Yes, your staff is a perfect example of that
[12:46]  The Sojourner: poor Kage looks like he has been riding a horse too long
[12:46]  You: Ha! Actually, Soj, that’s a pretty important detail we’ll get to soon
[12:47]  You: Priority for our needs with mecha are a sledgehammer kind of tool, that is, Mecha animations are totally “unnatural” to the normal SL av, so I typically set all the mecha animations to the highest priority to minimize overlap
[12:47]  Raistlin Otis is online
[12:48]  You: The notable exception to that is that I did not animate the mesh avatar’s head with the mecha animations, which is why the mesh head remains naturally articulated / animated even when I’m wearing this avatar.
[12:48]  Jurgi Harlan: Alright…at the same time, my priority 4 slump overrides my head movement.
[12:48]  Jurgi Harlan: How did you prevent the head override exactly?
[12:49]  You: Good question, and a key skill for animating capably
[12:50]  You: As it turns out, any animations we make only affect the joints for which we explicitly specify animations. So, in Poser or Avimator, we load up an SL mannequin and start manipulating, say, the left arm.
[12:50]  Forseti Svarog is online
[12:51]  You: If we upload that arm-waving animation without specifying any new movement for the other limbs, SL will continue to animate those other limbs normally while the arm animation plays or loops.
[12:51]  Jurgi Harlan: Does this cause a more natural blend, or more jerky chaos?
[12:51]  You: So, for this mecha set of animations, the arms, legs, and torso all have movements specified, but the head and neck do not.
[12:52]  You: Regarding jerkiness, much of that is dependent on (1) the character of the animation itself. Is it jerky? (2) the values specified in the transition-in and transition-out attributes when uploading the animation
[12:53]  You: those values determine how much weight the client gives to the early and late frames of the custom animation as it starts and ends.
[12:53]  You: basically analogous to a “fade in” and “fade out” effect
[12:54]  Jurgi Harlan: Transition-in and transition-out were very difficult for me, I mostly hotwired it until it ran for my slump.
[12:54]  Jurgi Harlan: I didn’t really have an understanding, just poked and prodded till it worked.
[12:55]  Jurgi Harlan: More training and examples would help…
[12:55]  Jurgi Harlan: But we can save it until appropriate…
[12:55]  The Sojourner is offline
[12:56]  You: Sounds good. Let’s finish up this discussion on articulation with a brief bit on joints of the mesh avatar and how we ‘hack’ them
[12:56]  Jurgi Harlan: So the goal when animating is to produce smooth movements that override as little as necessary to keep the body’s reactive coding intact.
[12:56]  You: Generally, yes. THat’s a good way to summarize it
[12:57]  Jurgi Harlan: Oh, yes, that’s a part I was definately curious about.
[12:57]  You: THough for mecha, we tend to have to take control of almost everything with the custom animations.
[12:57]  You: Soj noted earlier that I look like I’ve been riding a horse too long
[12:58]  Jurgi Harlan: Because of the wide hips.
[12:59]  You: That is an artifact of the fact that we cannot with custom animations break the joints of the av. That is, I cannot specify a shoulder joint position that is 5m, say, from the rest of the body. The joints, though they’re all raised into the air, have
[12:59]  You: to remain at normal human proportion to one another, except as far as we can push them with the normal appearance dials / sliders.
[13:00]  Jurgi Harlan: Yes.
[13:00]  You: So, since mecha are of course bigger than we are, all of the size-related sliders are maxed out for this mesh av to get the joints closer to where they should be for humanoid mecha.,
[13:01]  Jurgi Harlan: Yes, to keep the attachments moving as much like the body as we can.
[13:01]  Jurgi Harlan: The closer the body to the joints, the more natural the interplay.
[13:02]  You: But as you can see, the mecha’s knee joints are further out along the av’s y-axis (left-right). For legs, this isn’t much of a problem, since the hips and knees primarily function like hinges
[13:02]  Jurgi Harlan: For upper arms, you’ve substituted energy streams.
[13:02]  You: Since the prim legs are only slightly displaced, the effect is pretty good. Arms, however, are much trickier.
[13:03]  Jurgi Harlan: An inventive technique, in my opinion.
[13:04]  You: A last-ditch one. 😉 As you can imagine, the ball-and-socket joint and movement of the shoulder leads to crazy displacements as the animations play; the particle streams are one way around this problem
[13:04]  Jurgi Harlan: Yes, I couldn’t figure out how to make it work either…
[13:05]  Jurgi Harlan: I’ve been planning to save for a Decepticon or Gundam one to study their trick…
[13:05]  You: How much are they?
[13:06]  Jurgi Harlan: Though the code to make the streamers move from shoulder to elbow is another mystery to me.
[13:06]  You: I’ll walk you through that another day if you like.
[13:06]  Jurgi Harlan: I could take you to them…I don’t have prices memorized.
[13:06]  Jurgi Harlan: …um, wow.
[13:07]  Jurgi Harlan: Bring them with me when I come next time?
[13:07]  You: That should be enough to get you started on one or the other. Consider it a homework assignment to tear them apart and learn their techniques? Bring them if you wish
[13:07]  Jurgi Harlan: Will do sir!
[13:08]  Jurgi Harlan: I was also noting that the steam golem itself is moddable.
[13:08]  Jurgi Harlan: Though the demo version I have is not.
[13:08]  Lazarus Bogan is online
[13:08]  Jurgi Harlan: As I understood the sign.
[13:09]  Jurgi Harlan: And so you know, I am a buyer of your work.
[13:09]  You: Yes, that was intentional; the demo is simply a demo– if it were mod, folks would have no reason to get the full version. For those that did, I wanted them to be able to make it their own if they wished
[13:09]  Dirty McLean is offline
[13:09]  Jurgi Harlan: I have a question on this model however…
[13:09]  You: Yes?
[13:09]  Jurgi Harlan: if you would look at my left hip.
[13:10]  Jurgi Harlan: There is some loose tubing or handles or some such, free floating.
[13:10]  You: Ah, so I see. Carelessness in the gunship attachment on my part
[13:11]  Jurgi Harlan: Yours doesn’t have it.
[13:11]  Jurgi Harlan: Wait, there they are
[13:12]  Jurgi Harlan: After you transformed back to robot mode.
[13:12]  Jurgi Harlan: They’re there now.
[13:13]  Nomad Nighbor: COOL transformers convention 😀
[13:13]  Jurgi Harlan: Now they’re gone
[13:13]  You: Much better
[13:13]  You: Just had to fox 3 scripts
[13:13]  You: *fix
[13:13]  Jurgi Harlan: Alright…
[13:14]  Jurgi Harlan: Once they test clean, can I expect a copy?
[13:14]  Jurgi Harlan accepted your inventory offer.
[13:14]  You: I’ll update the vendor as well
[13:15]  Forseti Svarog is offline
[13:15]  Jurgi Harlan: Nice.
[13:15]  You: I think we’re at a good stopping point for today; Any last questions for the moment? Message me when we’re both online and we’ll continue
[13:15]  Jurgi Harlan: Only this.
[13:16]  Jurgi Harlan: May I use some of that Linden to purchase a Steam Golem to study?
[13:16]  Jurgi Harlan accepted your inventory offer.
[13:16]  You: Not much need for that. =)
[13:16]  Jurgi Harlan: THANK YOU!
[13:17]  Jurgi Harlan: I have been wanting this since I first laid eyes on it.
[13:17]  Jurgi Harlan: You have a thankful student.
[13:18]  You: Hey, no problem. Some folks learn best by pulling apart previous stuff and seeing what makes it tick.
[13:18]  You: That should be all moddable right down to the scripting
[13:18]  Jurgi Harlan: Thank you sensei, I will study well before our next meeting.
[13:18]  You: Open ‘er up and see what forms more questions for you. We’ll cover them when next we meet.
[13:18]  Jurgi Harlan: I will, and thank you again.
[13:19]  Kage Seraph nods.
[13:19]  Jurgi Harlan: I am off to purchase more mecha!
[13:19]  Jurgi Harlan: Farewell!
[13:19]  You: Have fun!

SLNN’s Ashley Gasser Interview

Ashley turned this chat into a very nice article over at SLNN.  Read it here:

[11:16] You: Hi, it’s very nice to meet you finally!
[11:16] Ashley Gasser: hi nice to meet you happy new year
[11:16] You: Happy new year to you as well. =)
[11:17] You: What can I do for you?
[11:17] Ashley Gasser: thanks
[11:17] Ashley Gasser: i actually wanted to talk to you about charity and giving to charity in sl
[11:18] Ashley Gasser: i know you run a group that is about charity
[11:18] Ashley Gasser: could you tell me a bit about that
[11:18] You: Sure, no problem.
[11:19] You: I started the !Meta charity group after a lot of thinking about how SL could be more than just a fun diversion for (primarily) well-off Westerners.
[11:21] You: So I figured, why not make something fun like the Elemental vehicle, and if people enjoyed it, !Meta would provide a way for them to offer thanks in a way that helps a community in Africa.
[11:22] Ashley Gasser: can anyone set up a charity or giving to charity in sl
[11:23] You: Informally, yes. Formal nonprofit charities are a bit more work than that. !Meta’s in the process of becoming a U.S. 501(c)3 organization, which just means lots of paperwork and things to become gov’t-certified.
[11:24] You: For example, Jade Lily’s Relay for Life in SL was (if I understand it) informal, but donated thousands of dollars to a formal RL charity.
[11:24] Ashley Gasser: so your group is in rl as well, right
[11:25] You: It is in the process of being in RL as well, but we’re not *quite* there yet.
[11:25] Ashley Gasser: what are you doing to get there
[11:26] You: At this stage, working through how the RL nonprofit will be structured, according to the rules at
[11:26] You: This is a pretty new way of doing things, so there are a lot of question marks to get through.
[11:27] Ashley Gasser: so what exactly is your group and what does it do
[11:27] You: As you know, the government only just got started investigating taxation of online profits– they’re still getting used to the idea of virtual charities.
[11:29] You: Well, !Meta is the group and essentially it acts as a conduit for SL merchants to donate a portion of their profits to charity. We’re currently discussing with several merchants about them donating entire products to the effort, so to speak.
[11:30] You: On the RL side, !Meta cashes out those $L to $US, and then wires the funds to active charities, such as the Kibaale Community Center in Uganda. The last step is to provide documentation of all these transactions so that people know their donations are getting to the right places.
[11:31] Ashley Gasser: so people can go through you to get the money to the charity
[11:32] You: If they prefer to, yes, though I must stress we are not yet a 501(c)3, so we cannot provide tax breaks for donors. Still working on that part. =)
[11:33] Ashley Gasser: so do you as charity get a lower l/us dollar exchange than other residents of sl
[11:34] You: Not that I’m aware of, though that’s an excellent idea to bug Linden Lab about.
[11:34] Ashley Gasser: i think so
[11:35] Ashley Gasser: :)
[11:35] You: Of course, by aggregating lots of small donations together, we save a bunch of $L on transaction fees and get more to the destination charity.
[11:35] Ashley Gasser: so why should people donate to charity in sl instead of rl
[11:36] Ashley Gasser: how can residents know that people raising money for charity in sl will really give it and keep their word
[11:38] You: That’s a huge concern for us, and it’s exactly why !Meta’s moving in the direction of becoming certified by the US government. Also, it’s the reason for the documentation I mentioned earlier.
[11:38] You: As far as donating in SL versus RL,
[11:39] You: I guess we don’t recognize the distinction between the two– the SL money is destined for the RL charities anyway, so at the end of the day the only difference is where the donors are.
[11:40] You: If people are more comfortable donating in RL, then we support that 100%. The point is helping charities, not making !Meta be the big name in SL charity work.
[11:42] Ashley Gasser: i know there are probably a lot of charities set up in sl and residents trying to raise money for charity. what can those wishing to donate do to investigate and make sure the claims are letgit
[11:42] Ashley Gasser: legit
[11:43] You: Good question! I would always advise as much investigation as is possible. If *anything* seems suspect, simply walk away. As you said, there are plenty of other charities that could certainly use the money.
[11:44] Ashley Gasser: how can residents investigate
[11:45] You: Be certain that the charity has a clearly articulated mission and provides adequate evidence that they DO what they say. Residents can investigate by contacting officers of the charity, past recipients of the funds if any are provided, etc. It all comes down to doing one’s homework responsibly to ensure that the charity is being responsible as well. =)
[11:46] Ashley Gasser: what about charities in rl vs those in sl
[11:46] You: I’m not sure I understand your question?
[11:47] Ashley Gasser: sorry should residents stick to charities they have heard about in rl
[11:47] You: Oooooh! Ok
[11:49] You: That is a safe, conservative strategy, yes. For people who decide that SL/virtual charities are worth the investment, it’s a pretty good idea to spread out donation over time, to give the donor a chance to track what the charity does with the money.
[11:50] Ashley Gasser: how can people track what is done with the money
[11:50] You: In !Meta’s case, most of the donations fall within the $L 10 – 2000 range, which is less than a nice cheeseburger in RL, so people can safely make small donations and see what happens.
[11:52] You: A good way to track donations is to check the charity’s website for scanned receipts / wire transfer slips, or once you know where the money ends up (for example, the Red Cross, though !Meta does not work with them currently), just contact the Red Cross and ask if they got the donation that the charity SAID they did.
[11:52] You: Always, always ask questions, yeah?
[11:53] Ashley Gasser: definitely
[11:53] Ashley Gasser: i guess you can’t say approx how many charities have set up in sl
[11:54] You: I sure don’t know, no. Hamlet Au would have a much better sense of that, as he is the ‘reporter’.
[11:54] You: But as SL grows rapidly, I would expect the number of charities to grow alongside that.
[11:54] Ashley Gasser: are more coming to sl is this a big sector of the economy
[11:56] You: Human nature being what it is, I would always expect the weapons and sex economic sectors to be much larger than charity work. However, the Relay for Life and the Katrina Relief charities were huge successes.
[11:56] You: I won three Linden Labbers for an hour each during one of the Katrina celebrity auctions. =) Great fun!
[11:57] Ashley Gasser: what was that
[11:57] You: A bit after hurricane Katrina, folks got together and hosted a number of charity events. Let me see if I can dig up a URL for your further research.
[11:58] Ashley Gasser: thanks that would be great
[11:59] Ashley Gasser: anything else
[11:59] You: As featured on MSNBC:
[11:59] You:
[12:00] Ashley Gasser: thanks
[12:01] You: Nothing else comes to mind. !Meta’s still getting set up, so I’d urge folks to hold off on donating for now if they have any reservations or doubts. Organizations like the Red Cross can always use the help, though. =)
[12:01] Ashley Gasser: so what will your organization donate to or is it more of a go between
[12:03] You: !Meta is designed as a go-between, yes, in the sense that we don’t spend the donations. Instead, we are the means to transfer lots of small donations to the folks on the ground doing the work, (in our case, at the Kibaale Community Center, ).
[12:04] You: If SL is 2 million-plus strong, imagine all the good stuff to be done if each person passed on $L 100 to their favorite charity. Good stuff.
[12:05] Ashley Gasser: if someone raised money and get your organizaton to handle it and give it to the organizatin of their choice
[12:06] You: We figure if someone can afford a powerful SL-ready computer and broadband, then $L 100 won’t hurt them too much. =)
[12:07] You: Eventually, yes. The initial plan, however, is to concentrate donations into the Kibaale charity, so that transaction and wire-transfer fees are held to the absolute minimum. As we grow, however, we’d *love* to be able to help additional charities that donors are interested in.
[12:07] Ashley Gasser: what is that charity
[12:08] Ashley Gasser: are u the only ones in sl doing it this way
[12:09] You: Given SL’s rapidly growing and already large size, I’d be surprised if we were the only one doing it this way, but I’m not aware of any others yet.
[12:10] Ashley Gasser: so do most charity supporters in sl just exchange the money and write a cheque to the charity
[12:12] You: It is difficut for me to speak for other charity supporters, but I supect you are correct. Especially given that LL exchanges currency out to Paypal, which is a pretty liquid (and therefore easily donated) format. Good question.
[12:12] Ashley Gasser: anything else
[12:12] You: The only other thing is that I’m honored to be interviewed by SLNN. =D
[12:13] Ashley Gasser: thanks for your time
[12:13] Ashley Gasser: best wishes with your organization and work: 0
[12:14] You: Thanks! It’s exciting stuff!!
[12:14] Ashley Gasser: c u
[12:14] You: Nice to meet ya! See ya!
[12:14] Ashley Gasser: u 2
[12:14] Ashley Gasser: thanks
[12:14] You: /wa
[12:16] Ashley Gasser: btw if you have any pics of yourself or the org could u send them to me
[12:16] Ashley Gasser: thanks
[12:16] You: Sure, will do!
[12:17] You: would you like them as textures or emailed as jpgs?
[12:17] Ashley Gasser: jpegs email is
[12:18] You: Excellent
[12:18] You: I’l take care of that today
[12:18] Ashley Gasser: have fun with the wings
[12:18] You: =)
[12:18] Ashley Gasser: thanks
[12:18] Ashley Gasser: c u
[12:18] You: Later!